Problem Exporting a Basic Shape
by Magra Thea · in Artist Corner · 09/23/2007 (2:41 pm) · 29 replies
I have no idea what im doing wrong....
Im a brand new user of Torque and recently downloaded Constructor 1.03 but Im having difficult even exporting the simplest of shapes.
I created a cylinder and textured it brown and tried to export it and it crashed the program.
I then re-launched and created a 10 meter sphere with 6 segments and it exported correctly.
I then created a 100 meter sphere with 12 segments and the program completely freaked the geometry on me.
I expect this possibly with a very complicated scene with hundreds of parts, but WHY am I supposed to expect this behaviour from just the creation of a SINGLE primitive?
Im a brand new user of Torque and recently downloaded Constructor 1.03 but Im having difficult even exporting the simplest of shapes.
I created a cylinder and textured it brown and tried to export it and it crashed the program.
I then re-launched and created a 10 meter sphere with 6 segments and it exported correctly.
I then created a 100 meter sphere with 12 segments and the program completely freaked the geometry on me.
I expect this possibly with a very complicated scene with hundreds of parts, but WHY am I supposed to expect this behaviour from just the creation of a SINGLE primitive?
#2
"Oh, use our tool, it works GREAT for boxes!!!" not telling you that it wont render Spheres!! Give me a break!
I've wasted an ENTIRE weekend on this crap. I have even reinstalled my video drivers!, always thinking the problem was in my computer.
09/23/2007 (5:31 pm)
Well, that is unconscionable. I dont give a damn if its included free. If its a "module" of Torque, it should at least work. Imagine the chaos if the same thing happened to 3DS Max or Maya???"Oh, use our tool, it works GREAT for boxes!!!" not telling you that it wont render Spheres!! Give me a break!
I've wasted an ENTIRE weekend on this crap. I have even reinstalled my video drivers!, always thinking the problem was in my computer.
#3
Constructor has been being worked on by GarageGames for a quite a while. They gave us many many screenshots of how it was going to be like. We (the developers) demanded they hurry up, and they did. Glitches are the result.
Complaining about something that's free is dumb. If it's that big of a problem, a lot of the scripts are uncompressed, so go ahead and fix the sphere geometry yourself.
We are all aware of glitches. Getting angry solves nothing.
09/23/2007 (5:38 pm)
@Magra:Constructor has been being worked on by GarageGames for a quite a while. They gave us many many screenshots of how it was going to be like. We (the developers) demanded they hurry up, and they did. Glitches are the result.
Complaining about something that's free is dumb. If it's that big of a problem, a lot of the scripts are uncompressed, so go ahead and fix the sphere geometry yourself.
We are all aware of glitches. Getting angry solves nothing.
#4
I EXPECT a professional company to produce a professional product. I understand its FREE, but that would be like stating that we would expect a free add-on from Autodesk to break our geometry just because its free???
That logic is as fractured as the sphere.
and its STUPID to think that a USER of a program has the necessary skill to FIX it??
Should I epect Open Office to Shred my documents just because its free? No. I expect it to work. Firefox is free, AVG is free. GIMP is free.. But I sure has hell expect them to work. They have very little future if they dont.
09/23/2007 (5:51 pm)
Im sorry, but just because I dont have the programming skills to fix such a problem does not mean I should "put up and shut up" thats just dumb.I EXPECT a professional company to produce a professional product. I understand its FREE, but that would be like stating that we would expect a free add-on from Autodesk to break our geometry just because its free???
That logic is as fractured as the sphere.
and its STUPID to think that a USER of a program has the necessary skill to FIX it??
Should I epect Open Office to Shred my documents just because its free? No. I expect it to work. Firefox is free, AVG is free. GIMP is free.. But I sure has hell expect them to work. They have very little future if they dont.
#5
09/25/2007 (7:38 am)
I'm not posting this really as a gripe... Im looking for honest guidance from anyone whos "been there before". If Im doing something wrong in Constructor, please let me know! 
#6
I don't expect you to fix it. I expect you to find something that gets your art into the engine. If Constructor is not doing it, then you need to find something else and use map2dif. I know people hate to hear that, but if your project is not getting done because of a tool, then change the tool. Otherwise the project will fester and die. I've had great luck with Constructor, except in terms of spheres and cylinders (and only when I make Cylinders have many segments).
For spheres and cylinders, modify the number of sides and segments until it fits within the bounds of your selection box. If it jumps out into a different area, you've crossed a boundary that C'tor is unhappy with. Next, save it as a .map file and then reload it to see if you get any errors with the geometry. Then export it to DIF. It may not be as smooth as you'd like it, but then if you need it to be at a high, smooth detail, a DTS might be a better option.
09/25/2007 (8:27 am)
Use Quark or Radiant or 3D World Studio, then. You have choices. As I said, spherical objects and many-sided cylinders have problems. If Constructor is not meeting your needs, use another application. Radiant had some major issues for months with curved surfaces in Quake 3 when it was released. There are a new issue with 1.5 that was mentioned on the listserv, but I can't recall what it was. I think it was in matching multiple curved surfaces. It's been about a week, I think.I don't expect you to fix it. I expect you to find something that gets your art into the engine. If Constructor is not doing it, then you need to find something else and use map2dif. I know people hate to hear that, but if your project is not getting done because of a tool, then change the tool. Otherwise the project will fester and die. I've had great luck with Constructor, except in terms of spheres and cylinders (and only when I make Cylinders have many segments).
For spheres and cylinders, modify the number of sides and segments until it fits within the bounds of your selection box. If it jumps out into a different area, you've crossed a boundary that C'tor is unhappy with. Next, save it as a .map file and then reload it to see if you get any errors with the geometry. Then export it to DIF. It may not be as smooth as you'd like it, but then if you need it to be at a high, smooth detail, a DTS might be a better option.
#7
I have tried quark and radiant. Both of those are written for people who grew up making levels for quake and unreal. I have never done that. A tutorial on those products would be helpful. Both seem to have severe learning curve problems.
Milkshape has tons of pieces missing. In MS, I saw nothing that let me change the xyz size of an obhect exactly. The resize tool seemed to only work by %. To me thats insane for doing any architectural building. I also looked at 3DWS -- I didnt even see a tool to make a sphere in it.
Every one of these tools appear to have very real issues. Is there something that just WORKS that I can model a 50meter sphere in?
09/25/2007 (10:53 am)
Why not lobby to get it fixed?I have tried quark and radiant. Both of those are written for people who grew up making levels for quake and unreal. I have never done that. A tutorial on those products would be helpful. Both seem to have severe learning curve problems.
Milkshape has tons of pieces missing. In MS, I saw nothing that let me change the xyz size of an obhect exactly. The resize tool seemed to only work by %. To me thats insane for doing any architectural building. I also looked at 3DWS -- I didnt even see a tool to make a sphere in it.
Every one of these tools appear to have very real issues. Is there something that just WORKS that I can model a 50meter sphere in?
#8
There are tons of tutorials available for Quark and Radiant. They will use various versions since they've been written over the course of years. There are also a number of Hammer tutorials available on the net. And they do have learning curve problems. Just like any other piece of modeling software...except that their learning curve is often simpler since it is CSG--simpler unless you are coming from traditional 3D editing, that is.
You should be able to make your sphere in Radiant, though TGE does not support bezier curves. As long as you steer clear of actual curved surfaces, you should be fine.
09/25/2007 (11:12 am)
Because right now, Constructor resources are extremely limited. Perhaps this new partnership will help out, but right now there is no telling *when*. You can "lobby" all you want, but if the resources are not there, then no amount of "lobbying" will get your game done at the end of the day.There are tons of tutorials available for Quark and Radiant. They will use various versions since they've been written over the course of years. There are also a number of Hammer tutorials available on the net. And they do have learning curve problems. Just like any other piece of modeling software...except that their learning curve is often simpler since it is CSG--simpler unless you are coming from traditional 3D editing, that is.
You should be able to make your sphere in Radiant, though TGE does not support bezier curves. As long as you steer clear of actual curved surfaces, you should be fine.
#9
I think at the beginning, it asks you what you will be exporting to, but Torque is not on the menu?
09/25/2007 (1:48 pm)
One major question about radiant....I think at the beginning, it asks you what you will be exporting to, but Torque is not on the menu?
#10
09/25/2007 (2:14 pm)
Choose Quake 3. You can do 2 as well. Then run your map through map2dif_plus. I do not believe you have to supply the -q2/3 option anymore.
#11
09/25/2007 (6:26 pm)
@David - how do you tell Radiant you want a sphere with more than 7 sides? 
#12
09/25/2007 (7:00 pm)
Make a square in the grid... then go up to the top and select brush, then to primitive, then sphere.. then fill in what number you would like.. hit ok.
#13
09/25/2007 (7:10 pm)
It will not allow a value larger than "7". It says so in the logs. a sphere with seven sides is really silly looking.
#14
09/25/2007 (7:15 pm)
Wow. I know you used to be able to. Maybe that functionality was replaced with curves. Well crap.
#15
09/25/2007 (7:53 pm)
What version of radiant are you using.. I just made a 20 sided one.
#16
I Have a series of buildings I want to make that are derived from floating balloons and dirigibles. I will need to model various spheres between 50 and 100 meters and a cyliendrical platoforms as much as 100 meters in diameter. So far, EVERY tool that exports DIF has been coming up short.
09/25/2007 (7:54 pm)
If someone can point to a proper tool. I have completely struck out here....I Have a series of buildings I want to make that are derived from floating balloons and dirigibles. I will need to model various spheres between 50 and 100 meters and a cyliendrical platoforms as much as 100 meters in diameter. So far, EVERY tool that exports DIF has been coming up short.
#18
I selected sphere and it askes me # of arbitrary sides...
I say "20" and nothing happens...
I check the logs...
Im choosing Q3 as I was instructed to.
09/25/2007 (8:01 pm)
I made a box on the screen.I selected sphere and it askes me # of arbitrary sides...
I say "20" and nothing happens...
I check the logs...
Quote:
Started logging to C:/Documents and Settings/Todd/Application Data/RadiantSettings/1.5.0/radiant.log
Today is: Tue Sep 25 22:55:35 2007
This is GtkRadiant '1.5.0' compiled Apr 26 2007
Official qeradiant.com build by namespace
Unable to find default tag file C:/Program Files/GtkRadiant 1.5.0/q3.game/shadertags.xml. No tag support.
OpenGL window configuration: colour-buffer = 32bpp, depth-buffer = none
Texture load failed: "textures/"
brushDragNew
dragTool
brushSphere: sides 20: too many sides, maximum is 7
Im choosing Q3 as I was instructed to.
#19
Doing what I stated above, this is the 20 sided brush it created.
09/25/2007 (8:08 pm)
I was satisfied with 1.4 so I rarely ever use that version. I do not know if that is the issue or not. Doing what I stated above, this is the 20 sided brush it created.
#20
09/25/2007 (8:16 pm)
I just re-read you post.. I think maybe for what your wanting them to do, you would want to use max or milkshape (etc). I'm not certain a dif will meet your overall needs in the end. (let alone a huge sphere dif will cause a large amount of draw). 
Associate David Montgomery-Blake
David MontgomeryBlake