New version of ms2dtsPlus (2.6.1)

#1 This is most awesome, I can't wait to try it. I really appreciate all your support for Milkshape.

#2 Thanks, Chris! I'll update my copy to the release version. Worked as I expected, coming from your shop, ;), I had no doubts...

I wish you had the time to create a better weight editor! One that had it's own little GL window that rendered the weight deforms. Just 'another' ms3d plugin, right? LOL, Rex; enough....

Hey all you C++, ms3ders out there....!!! Ms3d SDK is out there on the Chumbalum site.....:). Give Chris a break, lend a hand on getting the milkfarm as advanced as it can get! LOL.

Rex

#3 I am a milkshape 3der :) And a C++ programmer. If Chris is willing to send me the source I'll take a look.
I also have the ms3d sdk. I use these compiliers: Borland Builder 6 (C++), Delphi 7 (Pascal), Visual Studio .Net Architect 2003 (C++, C#, VB etc etc.)

@Chris HTML/CHM -> PDF
Let me do some digging on that.. I have a converter around somewhere.. I think it will export CHM to PDF.. It's been along time since I've used it tho so it will most likely be old pdf formats, but if you have a newer Acrobat version you can always re-save under new version.

@Rex
I have created a skeleton (human female type) with reference points that I wish to attach body parts to.
I read somewhere that there can be collision problems on such a setup. Do you have any suggestions or comments on the best way to do this (mount body parts)?

PS. I've been using the mountObject method and NOT the mountImage because of the 8 mount point limit on mountImage (TGE SDK 1.4).

#4 Ah, Sorry, PatG; I can't answer a question that deep into the engine. I know about the mount Nodes and more, but have no idea how to buid a body as you describe, as in 'attach body parts to'. If you're talking about aligning things across shapes, I may know a bit more..

The default has a max of 8 mount'Slots' for images/objects. The amount of mount'Points' a dts shape can have is, I believe, 32. This would allow you to use many different locations to have image/objects mounted.

Images have no collision information, while mounting objects will leave the object's collision data intact[if it has it within the shapeFile, of course], and their callbacks. This of course may lead to performance issues depending on the amount of data pushed around and kept track of...but v1.4 allows 'unlimited'??? collision meshes.

and Pat, working on such improvements to the ms3d flow is fantastic, I hope Chris can help you out. What would be a truely inspiring plugin would not only incorportate the weighting feature[that GL viewer part is !!!], but a Animation Joint Controller would be the crowning touch to the pipeline...! Something that would grab all the Joints within the Scene and their Local coordinates, generate a list or graphic image, and then allow selection[highlightion] and control of the selection's Local coordinates[Each separately=3 ctrls] via some nice UI control[heck text edit is fine too]; say a slider or widget of some kind.....would be so nice. Oh, and Record/SaveOut/etc.., ;). I'll test run anything you throw together, PatG...

Cheers!

#5 @Rex

This is my understanding of the mount points on shapes (and I could be wrong on this, using 1.4 SDK).
You are allowed 32 mount points on a shape. You can ONLY have 8 images (weapons etc.) on a player shape at one time, but can use all 32 for object shapes (not images, just regular static shapes). I think you're right on the collision meshes as far as you can have an "unlimited" number of them, but I try to use as few as possible since collision detection is one of the most CPU intensive tasks in Torque (and probably for any game engine for that matter :)). I'll check the source code to see if I find a true answer to the mount point thing.. here's a link in the forums that talks somewhat about the number of mount points you can have/use: www.garagegames.com/mg/forums/result.thread.php?qt=25529

For ms3d UI: you mean something like a Joint controller similar to 3ds Max?
Have you ever used CharacterFX? If so you mean something like that, but inside of milkshape?
I like the way CharacterFX does joints/animation control but it doesn't export to DTS, but it does have weighted vertices. Check out CharacterFX here: www.insanesoftware.de

I don't know how well CharacterFX exports weighted verts to Milkshape (exports as ASCII milkshape file) but like you I would love to have this ability in milkshape :)

I will start examining the Milkshape SDK to see what's possible...

#6 I checked out CharacterFX and kinda liked it, but it stagnated pretty quickly[basically dead software], no updates and I never went ahead and purchased a license. Heck, I've said it before; I'm not opposed to PURCHASING any tool/software, as long as it works as described and gets updated along...I mean, everybody who uses Ms3d wants better Animation control, setup and there are many programs that deal with ms3d format one way or another. Have a stable, feature rich program and folks will use it...deadware gets dusty.

Yes, somewhat like CharacterFX or anything better than the current schema. I have found some weirdness with the Local Coordinates used on some Joints which is why I'd like a 3rd party to handle it. FragMo works, other programs locals work... I can only get one local coordinate working correctly; sometimes not, sometimes all in Ms3d?? This goes back into sme 1.6x versions... Very odd.

#7 One of the things I noticed about ms3d... you sometimes have to zero the joints after making certain changes. I've gotten in the habit of always zeroing the joints before I export to DTS. That usually saves me a few minutes of extreme verbal detonations :)

Honestly.. I might be easier for me to make a seperate animation tool for milkshape files that exports directly to DTS. I have to say tho that Chris has done a very good job on his DTS exporter. .

A long time ago (um.. 10-12 years ago!) I was one of the developers for a Mission/Object edtior for MechWarrior 2: Mercenaries (was done by Activision back then) so 3d programming and programming in general aren't new to me :)

#8 I like the external app idea, Pat. Let's go just a bit further and something I've thought about for a while now. How about an application that takes a DTS file[Any package produced...] and controls and animates it?? Then saves the results as DSQ format. That way, anyone who has any DTS file can produce sequences for it...and with a nice controller to boot.


That, imho, is what is needed, or the extra step: a dedicated engine-cored dts/dsq shape/sequene builder...??? We got ShowToolPro, we'll soon get Constructor. Next we need Generator: spits out shapes and dsq files. TGE format only. That would make me very happy.

Sounds like your background is well suited for such an undertaking...I'll help anyway I can. I beat on things until they break here at the Werks...and take good notes, ;).

There is Shaper out there, which wants to fill the bill. Seems mesh oriented while I'm more motion based. I can get/manipulate/unwrapp a mesh a zillion ways, animating is a different story... I'm having issues with it's Animation Mode and blends, so I really can't use/test it out and give feedback, yet. Still a nice Ms3d based solution would be great, and cater to a wide audience here, I feel.

#9 Most likely I will go with the seperate app and stick to just animation control etc. (no modeling... yet.. :))
I need to get in contact with Mete (author of Milkshape 3d) and check out any legalities etc with him.
I like using Milkshape for doing models, but I too would like better animation controls.

I like the DTS/DSQ idea! As long as I don't allow exporting to any other formats I SHOULD be ok with GG. I'm gonna ask GG just to be sure.

I've already started the base app lol :)
I'm using OpenGL for the 3d stuff. I thought about using DirectX but I like working with OpenGL just as much as DirectX.

My first step will be importing ms3d files (both ASCII and binary).
I know people are wanting good joint controls.. What about a muscle system (similar to 3DS Max's skin modifier) for weighted vertices? (I Need to give that one alot of thought).

Keep giving it some thought Rex!
I'm hoping that in about 3-4 weeks I can send you an ALPHA version (depending on my availabilty).

#10 Thank you Chris!