In-Game Ads - A Great Opportunity if Indies Stay Away?
by Nick Zafiris · in General Discussion · 05/27/2005 (6:52 am) · 48 replies
From a Gamasutra article...
That's a lot of cash. I see two perspectives here. One is that what the big companies are doing with in-game ads and their whole commercialism is to further increase the gap between the two markets (indie/commercial) in terms of revenues, budget, exposure, and even separate the players further between hard core game players and indie game players. The reason is, I don't think indie game players want to see ads in their game. They're more interested in quality gameplay and fun. I personally don't want to see commercials in games. This could be a great opportunity if we stay away from in-game advertising by capturing the market that will turn their back to those big commercial games.
The other perspective is that we can get a piece of the pie from that $1 billion and that increased budget will certainly make us more competitive by enlarging our teams, buying better tools, marketing, etc. Sure, we wouldn't get GM car billboards or coca cola ads but smaller companies might be willing to pay a small amount for their products to be displayed. Don't know of any indie studio that couldn't use even $1000 extra.
I'm just curious what other indies think about this and what's best for us. Please keep it civilized.
Nick
Quote:- A study by survey company Yankee Group predicts that game-related advertising, as recently seen in Splinter Cell: Chaos Theory, will be a $800 million market by 2009, up from its size of $120 million in 2004. Mitch Davis, CEO of in-game advertising placement company Massive Inc., supported the study with his own prediction that the income game-related advertising would reach $1 billion by 2010. The Yankee Group study further indicated that one-third of the revenue will likely come from advergaming projects, rather than product placement or sponsorship within retail games.
That's a lot of cash. I see two perspectives here. One is that what the big companies are doing with in-game ads and their whole commercialism is to further increase the gap between the two markets (indie/commercial) in terms of revenues, budget, exposure, and even separate the players further between hard core game players and indie game players. The reason is, I don't think indie game players want to see ads in their game. They're more interested in quality gameplay and fun. I personally don't want to see commercials in games. This could be a great opportunity if we stay away from in-game advertising by capturing the market that will turn their back to those big commercial games.
The other perspective is that we can get a piece of the pie from that $1 billion and that increased budget will certainly make us more competitive by enlarging our teams, buying better tools, marketing, etc. Sure, we wouldn't get GM car billboards or coca cola ads but smaller companies might be willing to pay a small amount for their products to be displayed. Don't know of any indie studio that couldn't use even $1000 extra.
I'm just curious what other indies think about this and what's best for us. Please keep it civilized.
Nick
#2
The only time it didn't was in Crazy taxi. You had a KFC, pizza hut, the Gap, and many other well-known companies. The reason it didn't annoy me as much was that these 'ads' were seamlessly integrated in the gameplay. I mean, instead of just saying 'drive me to the restaurant', they say 'drop me at pizza hut's'.
So, for realistic games, I guess actual locations can actually enhance the cohesiveness of the game world to a certain extent
If indies find ingenious ways to integrate in-game ads, then I'm all for it!
05/27/2005 (7:20 am)
Usually, in-game advertising annoys the hell out of me. The only time it didn't was in Crazy taxi. You had a KFC, pizza hut, the Gap, and many other well-known companies. The reason it didn't annoy me as much was that these 'ads' were seamlessly integrated in the gameplay. I mean, instead of just saying 'drive me to the restaurant', they say 'drop me at pizza hut's'.
So, for realistic games, I guess actual locations can actually enhance the cohesiveness of the game world to a certain extent
If indies find ingenious ways to integrate in-game ads, then I'm all for it!
#3
05/27/2005 (7:36 am)
Personally I think in game advertisment is essential for the indie market if used correctly. I see nothing wrong in showing adds in racing games. Some texture has to be on the billboards, why not Budweiser's logo. In fact I think it adds to the suspention of belive. Not to mention it is a great source of extra income. 
#4
So the question really comes down to what is acceptable in-game advertising that is accessible to indies?
05/27/2005 (7:43 am)
Catch is though who will want to advertise with an indie game? With the exception of a small few, who are still small fishies, we aren't even minnows on the sonar thus the opportunity to get advertisements that actually suit the type of game that we are representing is slim. We could get a generic banner ad integration into our games but then we run the risk of alienating our users.So the question really comes down to what is acceptable in-game advertising that is accessible to indies?
#5
What is even available?
Who cares about the ethics/morals/etc if you can't even get the advertising in the first place :)
05/27/2005 (9:06 am)
I think the real question is rather simple...What is even available?
Who cares about the ethics/morals/etc if you can't even get the advertising in the first place :)
#6
05/27/2005 (9:24 am)
I quit watching Cable/TV because of commercials. So, If game advertising does happen to any game I plan to buy, it better be very subtle, as Joshua said. I already paid for the game and I seriously believe paying to see a commercial is BS. I know more money would be a great help getting our indie titles done but what about the customer. 
#7
Just an uneducated guess.
05/27/2005 (9:24 am)
Its gonna go through agencies. I think there are already shops that do that, they simply negotiate with big guys for now. However, once the "big market" is saturated, they sure will start looking lower. Most likely they'd deal with publishers though, not individual studios since it's simply not worth the effort. So there might be a time when, in order to get better terms (or get a deal at all) with publisher, you might need to sign up for inevitable ads packet as well.Just an uneducated guess.
#8
Yep, I have to agree. With the added question; how would you go about finding out what's available? (I'm not looking for anything right now, I'm just curious in general).
As for product placement in games/movies/whatever, I don't really see it as a problem. (of course it can go over board, but if done right it's fine by me). It makes your world more "real", and it's a whole lot better than watching the regular ads and commercials they force down your throat.
05/27/2005 (9:25 am)
@OneST8: Yep, I have to agree. With the added question; how would you go about finding out what's available? (I'm not looking for anything right now, I'm just curious in general).
As for product placement in games/movies/whatever, I don't really see it as a problem. (of course it can go over board, but if done right it's fine by me). It makes your world more "real", and it's a whole lot better than watching the regular ads and commercials they force down your throat.
#9
05/27/2005 (9:31 am)
@Eric: Personally, I'm 100% with you. I don't watch TV at all anymore... about the only entertainment of that sort that I still watch are movies (and I watch them on my computer so I can skip all the ads/previews). I don't rent but I do buy previewed and on very rare occasions I'll go to a theater but to put it this way; I haven't seen Star Wars Ep3 yet because I don't feel like being bombarded with commercial advertising and then slapped in the face with a $25 bill for a small pop and some nachos. Not to mention I'm still pretty steamed at Mr. Pukas for messing with the original versions of 4,5,6 and making it generally impossible to find the original copies. Anyways, I'm getting off topic here :P
#10
05/27/2005 (9:34 am)
Heres a new question that falls in line with this topic... What about games that are free to play (ie. trial periods or free samples or demos), is it appropriate to place advertisements such as banner ads or other in-game advertisement (since technicly the developers haven't made anything in terms of dollars from a sale) in games such as these?
#11
05/27/2005 (9:47 am)
@L Foster: I see no problems with that save one. Make the ads inadvertant... ie: don't force the user to watch a run of 30second clips and then let them play the game... make the ads "part of the game". The best example I can think of off hand is a sports game that takes place in some sort of stadium/arena with banner ads lining the walls. In that example people "expect" to see advertising there. Putting ads where they don't belong or forcing the user to watch ad clips is probably a very bad thing and would certainly rule me out as a member of the target audience.
#12
I suppose it may be because in the case of a free game the ads would be the "point" of releasing/making the game, it's going to be a lot more difficult in that situation to make the ads non-intrusive (in the sense OneST8 pointed out) and make them make sense in the game setting.
Ads where they belong; fine. "Objects" in your game that carry real brands; fine. Ads with the only reason of being ads; no thank you.
05/27/2005 (10:12 am)
@Foster: This may sound strange, but I actually have a tougher time accepting ads in that case than I would in a "normal" game. I'm not entirely sure why, just a feeling.I suppose it may be because in the case of a free game the ads would be the "point" of releasing/making the game, it's going to be a lot more difficult in that situation to make the ads non-intrusive (in the sense OneST8 pointed out) and make them make sense in the game setting.
Ads where they belong; fine. "Objects" in your game that carry real brands; fine. Ads with the only reason of being ads; no thank you.
#13
1) I'm indie and proud to the point of conceit. As soon as you take someone else's money, you're not 100% indie anymore. I never want creative control out of my hands (or even the possibility of it, even if unexcercised).
2) I hate advertisements on TV, in movies, on the radio, and in print, so I wouldn't subject my players to them. No matter how flawlessly subtle, it would bother ME.
3) They're not the bastation of evil, but they have nothing to do with fun or art, and those are my goals.
4) I don't need that extra level or mini-boss that would be paid for by an advertising contract. The game will be unique and fun enough without.
5) I don't need the paperwork/legal/contract headaches.
05/27/2005 (10:19 am)
Why I will never have ads in my games:1) I'm indie and proud to the point of conceit. As soon as you take someone else's money, you're not 100% indie anymore. I never want creative control out of my hands (or even the possibility of it, even if unexcercised).
2) I hate advertisements on TV, in movies, on the radio, and in print, so I wouldn't subject my players to them. No matter how flawlessly subtle, it would bother ME.
3) They're not the bastation of evil, but they have nothing to do with fun or art, and those are my goals.
4) I don't need that extra level or mini-boss that would be paid for by an advertising contract. The game will be unique and fun enough without.
5) I don't need the paperwork/legal/contract headaches.
#14
I think this idea is excellent, but it shouldn't interfear with the game and it's design.
05/27/2005 (10:34 am)
Anarchy Online partnered up with Massive Inc a few months ago. The commercials do not fall in as they do in TV commercials, they are textures that are dynamically applied to different materials upon entering a zone (created client side). So they do not "break" the game for a commercial like Cable TV, they just appear while you're playing on a billboard.I think this idea is excellent, but it shouldn't interfear with the game and it's design.
#15
And as a footnote; gah! How many "Massive" companies are there now? This is the third game related one I've seen... =)
05/27/2005 (10:50 am)
@Stefan: That's exactly what I ment. Although that dynamic ads thing (I'm assuming the billboards in AO will be updated once in a while?) still have a potential to get ugly. Static ads would be a whole lot easier to work into your enviroment in a way that it doesn't get "out of place".And as a footnote; gah! How many "Massive" companies are there now? This is the third game related one I've seen... =)
#16
Take a look at WildTangent. Aren't they an online publisher of casual games? They went all out with advertising partnering up with 24/7 Real Media to use their Open AdStream ad management system and are going crazy with advertisments of some big names. Take a look at this article and you'll see what I'm talking about. Does this leave more room for us pushing us to an even "nicher" market or do we need to follow? Should GG do the same?
Nick
05/27/2005 (2:58 pm)
There will always be gamers that hate in-game advertising and I'm not talking about billboards in a soccer game (which I think is perfectly acceptable). The way it's going, I think in the future there will be some gamers that will look for games that claim "No Advertisments Inside" and that's where we come in. The question is, will there be enough of them even for an indie game to survive?Take a look at WildTangent. Aren't they an online publisher of casual games? They went all out with advertising partnering up with 24/7 Real Media to use their Open AdStream ad management system and are going crazy with advertisments of some big names. Take a look at this article and you'll see what I'm talking about. Does this leave more room for us pushing us to an even "nicher" market or do we need to follow? Should GG do the same?
Nick
#17
I know that Aerial Antics has at least 100,000 downloads ... it didn't sell 100,000 copies but what company wouldn't want their ad in an indie game's trial version at least? They don't care how many copies you sell ... only how many people are subjected to their ad ... especially in a closed environment like a game. Most indie games probably get more exposure through their demos than a lot of standard console games if you think about it.
05/27/2005 (3:18 pm)
Quote:
Catch is though who will want to advertise with an indie game?
I know that Aerial Antics has at least 100,000 downloads ... it didn't sell 100,000 copies but what company wouldn't want their ad in an indie game's trial version at least? They don't care how many copies you sell ... only how many people are subjected to their ad ... especially in a closed environment like a game. Most indie games probably get more exposure through their demos than a lot of standard console games if you think about it.
#18
My views are, as I said before, ads for the sake of having ads is probably not a good thing, no. I think we should separate things a bit, basically; ads = bad. Product placement = can be okay. (the "product placement" may very well be a billboard with an ad, but then it should make sense and fit well with the environment in your game).
@Alessi: Well, the problem is; before you got those 100,000 downloads it's difficult to do anything about it. And if you add ads to the game later we're back and my original reservation of ads = bad, product placement = okay. Product placement takes considerably more thought and is more difficult to "add on later".
05/27/2005 (3:30 pm)
@Zafiris: WildTangent have always been nuts (or idiots depending on how you want to see it...).My views are, as I said before, ads for the sake of having ads is probably not a good thing, no. I think we should separate things a bit, basically; ads = bad. Product placement = can be okay. (the "product placement" may very well be a billboard with an ad, but then it should make sense and fit well with the environment in your game).
@Alessi: Well, the problem is; before you got those 100,000 downloads it's difficult to do anything about it. And if you add ads to the game later we're back and my original reservation of ads = bad, product placement = okay. Product placement takes considerably more thought and is more difficult to "add on later".
#19
05/27/2005 (3:37 pm)
True ... but once you've got one game up that proves you can get a lot of exposure you could get another game done but with product placement. I agree ... regular old ads or sale screens would be lame ... but if integrated properly is cool. I used to love the fact that Pizza Hut and stuff were in Ninja Turtle games ... made it just seem more tangible.
#20
06/02/2005 (1:37 am)
Sounds like you're all talking about ads that benefit the publisher. How about ads that the server operator can insert? A lot of server operators could use the cash to stay in operation and pay for their bandwidth. 
Torque Owner Joshua Spencer