Stuck at laying out a proper skill tree.
by Kyrah Abattoir · in Game Design and Creative Issues · 02/15/2012 (5:42 pm) · 5 replies
I am trying to setup a skill training concept for my game that uses a "tree" design, basically you start learning general skills and as you get better your knowledge is more and more precise:
For example you start using a rifle, and will first level basic "combat" knowledge, then as you complete basic combat, the tree divide in two: melee and ranged, but since you are using a rifle, it only give skill points to the ranged sub category, and so on.
The key to this system obviously is to some up with core "base" skills that are able to encompass the entire range of activities the player can gain skills into.
Here is where i am at: http://dev.ethernia.net/index.php/DustyRoads/SkillSystem
I have a combat tree, which obviously will contain everything combat related, this tree is simple, obvious and I'm sure that i need it.
The crafting tree trunk is a problem for me at the moment, because on one side, crafting is the action of making things, but it doesn't necessary means, the scientific background to do it. For example you could probably build a plasma rifle if given the proper instructions by someone who can design one. You could even become a good plasma rifle builder, but know nothing about it.
So I guess i could have two master trees, fabrication, and science, but then they will become very redundant from one to the other, crafting will have medikit manufacturing and science, medikit application for instance...
Defense at first appeared to be a good tree trunk, BUT I am wondering if I shouldn't group it into the combat tree because I am not sure i will provide that many defensive skills (i am making what's essentially an fps game), and it's still something about combat.
Survival, again this felt like a good idea but it's nothing more than a specific scientific knowledge and should probably join an hypothetical "Science" tree trunk.
The bottom line is that, beside the Combat tree trunk, I'm not really happy with what i have, it doesn't feel like it's encompassing the entire range of possible actions so i started piling up the skills at the bottom of the page.
If anyone has suggestions or a method i could apply to solve this big bundle of uncertainty, I'm all ears.
For example you start using a rifle, and will first level basic "combat" knowledge, then as you complete basic combat, the tree divide in two: melee and ranged, but since you are using a rifle, it only give skill points to the ranged sub category, and so on.
The key to this system obviously is to some up with core "base" skills that are able to encompass the entire range of activities the player can gain skills into.
Here is where i am at: http://dev.ethernia.net/index.php/DustyRoads/SkillSystem
I have a combat tree, which obviously will contain everything combat related, this tree is simple, obvious and I'm sure that i need it.
The crafting tree trunk is a problem for me at the moment, because on one side, crafting is the action of making things, but it doesn't necessary means, the scientific background to do it. For example you could probably build a plasma rifle if given the proper instructions by someone who can design one. You could even become a good plasma rifle builder, but know nothing about it.
So I guess i could have two master trees, fabrication, and science, but then they will become very redundant from one to the other, crafting will have medikit manufacturing and science, medikit application for instance...
Defense at first appeared to be a good tree trunk, BUT I am wondering if I shouldn't group it into the combat tree because I am not sure i will provide that many defensive skills (i am making what's essentially an fps game), and it's still something about combat.
Survival, again this felt like a good idea but it's nothing more than a specific scientific knowledge and should probably join an hypothetical "Science" tree trunk.
The bottom line is that, beside the Combat tree trunk, I'm not really happy with what i have, it doesn't feel like it's encompassing the entire range of possible actions so i started piling up the skills at the bottom of the page.
If anyone has suggestions or a method i could apply to solve this big bundle of uncertainty, I'm all ears.
About the author
3D artist, programmer, game designer, jack of all trades, master of none.
#2
Now obviously it's a bit hard when it hasn't been defined yet wht the player can do, so i'm trying to find generalist trunks that i'm certain of.
I'm not sure, science could help you design an uber demolisher 20k but using a gun is usually a matter of aiming the side stuff comes out of squeezing the trigger
02/18/2012 (3:50 pm)
Well my planning isn't very strict yet, the way i look at it i'm trying to define general trunks that can encompass everything the player could do in the game that require some skill checks.Now obviously it's a bit hard when it hasn't been defined yet wht the player can do, so i'm trying to find generalist trunks that i'm certain of.
I'm not sure, science could help you design an uber demolisher 20k but using a gun is usually a matter of aiming the side stuff comes out of squeezing the trigger
#3
Combat: encompass everything from attacking to defending
Manufacturing: everything that is tied to creating stuffs, repairing or transforming
Science: this is every knowledges from medicine to chemistry and mechanic.
One idea was that in order to craft something you need something like, assembly instruction, for every kind of objects. Assembly instructions can be created by high science players, from technology blueprints.
Player A is a science type and find a blueprint about fusion cells and learn it.
Player A uses create assembly instructions for am micro fusion cell.
Player B is a manufacturer and get the assembly instructions from A, learn it and craft a micro fusion cell.
Player C is an adventurer, get the MF cell from B and use it to power his flashlight :D
I'm not sure, it makes sense but i really do not like it.
02/18/2012 (3:59 pm)
One idea i had was that:Combat: encompass everything from attacking to defending
Manufacturing: everything that is tied to creating stuffs, repairing or transforming
Science: this is every knowledges from medicine to chemistry and mechanic.
One idea was that in order to craft something you need something like, assembly instruction, for every kind of objects. Assembly instructions can be created by high science players, from technology blueprints.
Player A is a science type and find a blueprint about fusion cells and learn it.
Player A uses create assembly instructions for am micro fusion cell.
Player B is a manufacturer and get the assembly instructions from A, learn it and craft a micro fusion cell.
Player C is an adventurer, get the MF cell from B and use it to power his flashlight :D
I'm not sure, it makes sense but i really do not like it.
#4
Even older games like Ultima Online, even though UO's was pretty big it was a very simple straight forward skill tree.
02/19/2012 (9:22 am)
Have you thought about looking at other games that use 'skill trees'? one i really like is the skill tree's in Dragon Age 2, simple in it's complexity. Even older games like Ultima Online, even though UO's was pretty big it was a very simple straight forward skill tree.
#5
For example, a player who never used a pistol will benefit from his experience in rifle, because they are both ranged weapons and both in the combat tree.
If he uses a rifle:
combat(10/10) -> ranged(10/10) -> rifles(10/10) = 30 pts
If he uses a pistol (he never used a pistol):
combat(10/10) -> ranged(10/10) -> pistol(0/10) = 20pts
If he uses a sword (he never used a sword):
combat(10/10) -> melee(0/10) -> slashing weapons(0/10) ) 10pts
So basically when you train your skills, you gain points in the "path" from the root of the tree, that goes toward the mastery skill of this weapon, and when you use a weapon your skill is calculated by adding together the points in the path that lead to that skill.
02/19/2012 (11:46 am)
Well UO was my favourite, no tree at all, what i'm trying to make here is like Ryzom used to do, basically, if you use an item, it benefits from all the points from the branch leading to it's usage skill.For example, a player who never used a pistol will benefit from his experience in rifle, because they are both ranged weapons and both in the combat tree.
If he uses a rifle:
combat(10/10) -> ranged(10/10) -> rifles(10/10) = 30 pts
If he uses a pistol (he never used a pistol):
combat(10/10) -> ranged(10/10) -> pistol(0/10) = 20pts
If he uses a sword (he never used a sword):
combat(10/10) -> melee(0/10) -> slashing weapons(0/10) ) 10pts
So basically when you train your skills, you gain points in the "path" from the root of the tree, that goes toward the mastery skill of this weapon, and when you use a weapon your skill is calculated by adding together the points in the path that lead to that skill.
Torque 3D Owner Tuomas Kaukoranta
For example, if you do Combat and Survival only, you have both of them at high level, you can fire your weapons accurately and reload them quickly, you can cook food, you can heal your wounds. You can make it with these 2 trees picked.
On the other hand, you can use Research and one of the other trees. If you have Combat alongside Research, you can use very specialized weapons like the plasma gun and �ber-Demolisher 20k, but you lack most of the Survival skills. Likewise if you have Research and Survival, your combat skills are minimal, but you can craft some very specialized stuff like some mechanical augmentations for example and also build and sell hi-tech weaponry for other players.
This is just my 2 cents, and probably far from what you've planned yourself.