Torque3D and Unity's New Pricing

#61 Can I delete my last post. . .lol

Yea, right-click open in new tab did not show your whole profile. However, just clicking it did. Already sent an email.

#62 Josh's post on page #2 from this thread mentioned something quite interesting about unity the web player, since th eengine now being free commercial or non commercial purposes it can be the next global flash player i must say.

unity made a great smart move, brilliant viral marketing campaign, I am very impressed.

both T3D and Unity are great technologies, one with source access and one without it,

But to be honest, I might say that probably 60% and up of game developers wont probably mess with engine source code, well at least from unity source code since I dont think you will need it to build an average game or even a pro one.


I am sad to say that I was looking forward to get T3D indie or artist version when released, since being a hobby game dev, I just can not afford $1000 for pro right now, maybe later when economy gets better, for a game engine.

I also was looking for use it with TMMOKIT, but it looks like mmorowrkshop is gone for good. sorry to hear that. another sad story which I dont want to go there right now.


but with free unity, you just cant beat that. free is free, and even to create commercial or non commercial which is even greater.

So I must say I wish GG has this aproach for indie devs since I kind of liked T3D a lot but free is free, and the saddly part of greater part will be is that I am falling in love with Unity now.

Love at first sight, well not really, I had previously used before but now knowing is freeeee, is candy for me..

Anyways, thanks GG your new T3D engine rocks, I loved the demo, althought I dont know if it is my hardware or not but when I run the demo and use the ingame editor, It looks like probably the new rendering uses more resources than previous TGEA, it just becomes a little laggie, so I had to resize window to small size in order not to get a headache while viewing the screen. and I am using a code2duo machine with 9600 video envidia card. I mean is not the latest machine but it sure is common average harware now adays.

Best wishes to all.

keep up the good work and see you soon and hoping GG will pull one out their sleves soon..

#63 Well your computer might not be able to handle advance lighting that well its set automatic with new builds. i think basic lighting should be set to load on new builds first so people that don't have high end computers can run it easy. to change from AL to basic lighting in the world editor up top there is a tab that say lighting click it and change to basic then save then exit and reload that mission.

#64 @pilotcap232 -

The TMMOKit that Josh originally built for Minions of Mirth is alive and well. The community mostly migrated discussions to mmorpgmaker. ( http://mmorpgmaker.com/phpBB3/index.php )

Both TGEA and T3D variants are being worked on by community members.

#65 [quote="pilotcap232"]but with free unity, you just cant beat that. free is free, and even to create commercial or non commercial which is even greater.[/quote]

Free is free, but they also say that you get what you pay for. I think Unity releasing their Basic edition for free was a great move on their part. That combined with GG no longer selling TGEA or TGE, and they have really put themselves into a good spot there. You have to believe they did that move though because they figured many of those free users would eventually pay the $1500 license fee when they got ready to ship their game. They also instituted some mixed version regulations, meaning if anyone on your project is using the Pro version, everyone must be. That probably there to go along with the sub-$100,000 portion of the EULA.

Unity Pro vs. Torque 3D, I'd take Torque 3D hands down. Unity Free vs. Ogre 3D or any of the low end or free engines, I'd take Unity.

#66 If you would take Unity over Ogre then how does

Quote:Free is free, but they also say that you get what you pay for.

apply? To me, it seems you are implying that it is not and was not worth $150. Well, I think the market might disagree with that. And, as far as what Unity hopes/wants the free users to eventually upgrade to, my understanding is you don't *have* to pay $1500 when you ship. I wish I get could get T3d Artist version free, and pay $1500 when or if I ship a game...I am pretty sure that would make ALOT of people happy if Torque did that! What Unity did was a true gift to the indie market, period. Thanks Unity, for giving us options.

#67 I dont think the reason UT made the engine free because of low quality engine, a bug free, real easy to use, and good pipe line little engine specially for artists or advanced devs. in fact its been one of the top game engines choices for hobbiest and pro devs outthere ever since it became windows platform support.

I think it will apply the same thing for T3D artist version.

I mean, lets recap, T3D artist version at $500/seat vs Unity3d basic free version, what would you think I will pick.


I mean , yeah, I am a GG fan myself too, but lets face it. what UT did was a knock out to several game engine company outhere among their competitors.
And I think their main purpose to release the engine for free was not only to let the hobbiest game devs create games and before publish they will have buy pro, since the way it is is free for commercial and non commercial use.

but I think they did it for their web player plugin deal, it will be like another flash player kinda deal, you can easilly create your own game or non game based presentation for what ever you like and use it on any website or spread it around the net, I think thats what they are aiming for, which is brilinat idea. sooner or later it will virally spread out and become another standard web player plugin.

GG is also well known for their great quality products, and I must admit GG have a great marketing strategies and have been doing it for long time which makes the engine very popular outhere, but with T3D release and descontinuing TGE, TGEA, they pretty much left the hobbiest devs out of the loop.

and believe me, between Unity pro and T3D I will chose T3D myself too, if I had the extra cash for it, reasons are, $1500 vs $1000, Ill take the $1000 one and plus I will get the source code, plus a great top of the line engine and plus because I am a fan also of torque too which wont go away overnight just because something outhere is free.

but now the way global economy is, which is it baddddd, and wait a little more and it will even get worse, just wait and see, lots of people, businesses, hell, even countries going into bankruptcy, take Iceland for instance, too much struggling because of the bad economy , and that is including myself trying to at least maintain the same lifestyle as before, but is hard. this is some serius stuff going on globally.



@David:
Yeah, I am aware of that, I have been following the mmokit on mmorpgmaker myself too. and Josh is been doing a great job by porting T3D to mmokit, but so far we all been spectators only since there is no release yet at least to the public like it was before with TGE 1.5 or TGEA 1.7, due of licenses concerns, and I would of done the same thing if I was on his shoes, since I would not like to get into legal issues down the road.

the original community website mmoworkshop is been out for more than a month, due of server migration, but lets face it, there is more into it than just a server migration.
but ohh well, is PG site and they pretty much can do what ever they like to it and thats their right. so the community was left homeless so now they all hang out at mmorpgmaker since the community still active.

But anyways, there is always a reason for anything, so I guess is all for good. and we must be happy for what we got and lets just move forward and work with what we got so far.


@Brandon:
thanks for the tip, yes indeed disabling advanced lighthings did the job, it now works much better FPS.


thanks guys.

Good day.

#68 I think there is a big misunderstanding of the way that Unity works that makes everyone think that not having source code access is draw back. The 'core' of Unity is very simple in concept. It doesn't lend itself to any type of game specifically. It's basically a starting off point. If you spent 10 minutes playing with the engine, you'd realize that it's a very different animal. What unity programmers would consider scripting, most GG developers would consider programming. Unity doesn't have things like game controllers and such major components that are ready made and part of the source code. You need to write everything yourself from scratch, or use stuff from an sample game project (in which case you'd have the source code). Basically needing the source code would be like needing to edit the linux kernel in order to write linux applications.

They are different products and everyone has preferences, however the source code wouldn't be seen as something that deters making certain types of projects, as it makes no difference. Try it, you may hate it, you may love it, but it's interesting to know how other things work.

#69 @Kevin - This is the same thing with Leadwerks Engine. In many ways not having the source is good, the developers tend to fix bugs quickly.

#70 @Kevin

You kno,

You are certainly right, lots of people think that if you dont get the source code from unity you will be capped or stucked, but after playing with unity, you just relaized you dont need the source code, and indeed the engine is not a genre specific kinda game maker, is a general type kinda core. so yes, you can crate any kind of game here, from fps to mmo rpg games 2D, 3D, etc.. by just scripting yourr way out from scratch, no need to modify engine source code at all.


for instance, we all know that tge/tgea is or was pretty much fps genre related engine, right? I dont know about T3D but I must imagine is the same principle.

so in order for you to create something else like rpg etc... you will need ot modify the source code, which was provided so you are not capped or stucked with it. well, it looks like in unity you dont really need the source code to make any kind of genre game, all you need is to script it and thats it.

So, with T3D you get source code and you got the freedom modify whatever you want and make whatever kind of genre game outhere.

In unity you dont get the source , but you can do whatever genre you want by just scripting.

so is the same thing, both are good technology and both are great tools to help you make games.

#71 unity free does not come with advanced lighting and render effects,all those great effects and shadows are not included.you will have to spend $1500 to have these essentials.
trust me,i bought unity indie LOL,when it wasnt free,once the demo is done and your water looks like water from the tge v1,youll be thinking about that extra $1500 to continue with whatever project youre doing.

if youre serious about gaming youll need to upgrade and if you aint got $1500 tuff,rather pay for an artist version of torque with all the tools for the job,then upgrade later

#72 Do you mean a game is not serious without using some nice looking water?

With the artist version of T3D (no source code, remember), will you be able to do much more than replacing Korg with another model, changing textures and adding some buildings to the same old simple FPS?

#73 The "free" Unreal SDK is ready for use now:
www.udk.com/

I think T3D is the better deal. UDK is free for free games or applications, so it's unrestricted there. You get the first $5000 in earnings without a fee also. After that, all income related is going to cost you 25% in royalties. Good to see another option on the indie market, though.

#74 I have to say one thing about comparing the engines. The GG forums are a lot more responsive so far when people post problems. I have posted 3 questions on the Unity forums and so far have got 1 response to all of them. Not a reflection on the tech, but the community here seems more mature and knowledgeable and that's something money can't buy.

#75 I am going to Unreal. Even if you made $1,000,000 , you are essentially getting your Unreal license for $250k (obviously with no source).

#76 @David Chan
That may be so about the forums. Quickest way to get Unity help is to goto the irc channel. It's extremely active 24 hours a day. (I was on a reverse sleep schedule for awhile, so I've seen it at all times :P) #unity3d on freenode.

(FYI, I'm not here to Troll and be a Unity fanboy... actually I'm evaluating tgb for some 2d iphone stuff. I've heard that TGB is where it's at for doing 2D.)

#77 We've got IRC too, you know ;)

Yes, the upcoming T2D looks like it's going to be really great out of the box. The current version needs a little tweaking.

#78 glad to see some people are finally understanding the no source with Unity is not really a huge downside (and for a lot of developer's, not a downside at all).

@David Chan: I have to disagree. I have had the complete opposite experience as far as the forums going from TGEA to Unity (ie. Unity is good and TGEA was bad).

#79 @David Chan
Tottally Agree. This community is one of the better assets that Torque has, and is by far the most useful community you can found around a game engine.

#80 Is this a new licensing deal with Unreal?