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Terrain Master, Take 2: the FlightGear World Server!

by Chris Calef · 05/07/2013 (2:23 pm) · 65 comments

www.brokeassgames.com/blogs/chris/FGWorldServer/SunsetHeaderBar.800.jpg
Sunset in the hills west of Eugene - rendered in FlightGear and Unity3D.

A number of people expressed interest in a recent little side project of mine, wherein I implemented a paging terrain system in T3D, and filled it with real world DEM data from the Willamette Valley in Oregon.

This blog isn't really about that.

This blog is about the journey that began last November with that project... and finally ended up back here in T3D, five weary and haggard months later, with a project that, even in its current state of v0.001 (barely even working) is already one of the coolest things I've ever done.

The weird part started innocently enough. In a moment of relaxation, I did a google search for an open source flight simulator. Back a couple of lifetimes ago IRL, I used to fly an ultralight airplane, and meanwhile had also become interested in a partly flight-sim based game called World War II Online.

One thing led to another, as they tend to do, and before long I was taking a peek around to see what had happened in the world of open source flight sims in the past decade or so. What I immediately stumbled right into was:

www.FlightGear.org


www.brokeassgames.com/blogs/chris/FGWorldServer/FlightGear02.jpg

Now this is all well and good. Nothing wrong with a little casual entertainment - even if it does involve much merriment from your non-gamer wife, re: the sudden fascination with your new "joystick". Such is the price we pay...

However, besides being an incredibly detailed flight simulator, with accurate engine behaviors, hundreds of supported aircraft, and even multiple whole flight dynamics systems to choose from... I soon discovered that FlightGear also includes a complete, game ready representation of the entire exposed landmass of the Earth (give or take the polar regions). Along with day/night cycles, moon cycles, a starfield, and local weather simulation complete with a whole library of 3D cloud models, all automatically synched up to accurate realtime weather data by region.

www.brokeassgames.com/blogs/chris/FGWorldServer/FlightGear01.jpg
Yes, that is a heavy storm front out over the ocean.

At this point you may well be wondering where exactly I'm going with all of this. Certainly FlightGear sounds like an interesting project, but what does it have to do with Torque?

Very well, if you must know... please allow me to lay my cards on the table. After which you can decide whether to stay with me through the rest of this blog, or run away screaming.

Summary: I have written a modified version of FlightGear to function as a "World Server", for the purpose of serving terrain data and skybox images in realtime to a separate client application, written in Unity or Torque.


www.brokeassgames.com/blogs/chris/FGWorldServer/Terrain.SouthEugeneNE.800.jpg
The wizard character from Unity's Advanced Multiplayer Kit, in South Eugene looking NE.

Now, in case I've completely lost you with the above proclamation ("You have written WHAT? For the love of God, WHY??") ... please allow me to explain myself.

As mentioned in the above referenced blog, I have a long-term interest in creating a post apocalyptic MMO game based in real world terrain.

Most games have no interest or need to include the entire planet in their assets, of course, but I had this clever idea... "wouldn't it be interesting if my players could run scenarios in their own home landscapes?"

Once one allows oneself to even think along these lines, the potential applications start to multiply exponentially.

However, the 800 pound fly in the ointment, of course, is the fact that the planet we live on happens to be extremely large.

While data exists on the internet to both replicate and surpass all of the work done so far by the FlightGear team - to assimilate the height data, provide some kind of reasonable textures for all land area, and fill in a base level of at least aircraft-relevant objects like radio towers, skyscrapers and of course airports - the undeniable fact remains that this, in and of itself, represents a massive amount of work. As in, many human years.

And if there's one thing I've learned in the past four or five years of smashing my own poor indie existence up against the craggy rocks of Software Time, it would have to be this:

Never, ever, ever start *anything*, unless you have first made absolutely sure there is not an easier way.


www.brokeassgames.com/blogs/chris/FGWorldServer/Terrain.CoburgsSW.400.jpg
Standing in the Coburgs, before local terrain textures worked.

But once I started looking around in the FlightGear world, and seeing the incredible volume and quality of effort expended thus far to make it happen, the thought slowly began to form in my mind that this project had to be relevant in some way to my end goals. I simply could not see it and then just walk away and start over.

The exact mechanism remained, and still remains, open for debate. It is a given that most games do not require the end user to start two separate 3D applications just to make the game run, and this setup would not be my first choice.

However, there are many other ways that FlightGear's accomplishments could theoretically be leveraged, beyond the way I am doing it here in v0.001. It could well be that an ultimate solution would involve chopping out whole sections of FlightGear or its underlying utility code, and incorporating them directly into a first person game engine, so that the game itself could read FlightGear's stored data instead of having to talk to a separate instance.

Of course, that in itself represents a seriously non-trivial amount of programmer time - and we are pretty much out of budget around here for extra months of programmer time.

So, yes, it is awkward, and probably undesirable for a finished game, but regardless of any future ambitions we may have, in the current implementation of this project, we must run two major apps side by side to get the results we need. That is where it stands, and for now we must take it or leave it.

Let's look at another pretty airplane picture while we get used to that.

www.brokeassgames.com/blogs/chris/FGWorldServer/FlightGear03.jpg
Isn't that better?

Now that we have that little dose of reality out of the way, let's look at the myriad number of silver linings that I discovered along my path of least resistance:

  • The world server is completely application-agnostic. The same world server build can talk to any client application that is capable of opening a socket and following the rules, it does not have to be recompiled to work with a different client.
  • The world server need not be limited to operating on the same machine. In certain (cough, mobile) environments it might make sense to stream skybox images and terrain data over a network, to allow major data storage and image rendering to be done in the cloud.
  • The world server is still a perfectly operational copy of FlightGear, which could become highly relevant for any first person games that have ambitions of including a flight sim among their vehicle options.
  • While it may seem weird for a game, in a serious simulation app it is not all that bizarre for multiple windows to open up.
  • FlightGear is licensed under the GPL, but by operating a completely separate application over a socket, the client software is free to operate under whatever license it wants.

Gotcha with that last one, didn't I? I kind of forgot to mention it earlier, but yes, FlightGear is GPL. For my purposes, that does not actually scare me that much, but for others, it could obviously be a critical factor.


www.brokeassgames.com/blogs/chris/FGWorldServer/Terrain.CoburgsSE.800.jpg
In the Coburg Hills, looking southeast, before terrain textures worked. The lighting problem between different skybox sides is fixed now as well.

How It Works

To avoid rambling on interminably here and instead start wrapping this thing up, I'm going to have to leave out most of the technical details. To put it in the most basic terms, the client application opens up a socket to FlightGear and sends the current player position in latitude/longitude, as well as some other data, such as the heightmap and texture resolution of our local terrains, and the path to which image and data files should be written.

FlightGear then samples its own terrain data and returns a set of nine terrain height files, nine terrain texture index files, and five skybox images. The client app then loads these into the game world, and voila, we have an FPS portal into the FlightGear world.

Of course, it wouldn't be version 0.001 if it didn't have a host of problems. It's currently slow and clunky, and there are whole subsystems not even implemented yet (like handling FlightGear objects in the game engine and vice versa.)

The most important part for me, however, is that I now have a solid foundation, a starting point, for all of my future megalomaniac plans of world domination.

HINT: Imagine a shared online real-world-based sandbox environment, like Second Life crossed with Google Earth, but in a first person game environment. And then imagine it is open source, and users can host their own servers or add their own "multiverse" layers to an existing server, and ultimately create their own mini-games, simulations, art projects or anything else they want to share, with everyone or just with their own friends.

www.brokeassgames.com/blogs/chris/FGWorldServer/Terrain.SpencerButteW.800.jpg

Well, that escalated quickly, didn't it? I apologize for the roller coaster ride here, but there is really no way to explain this whole project without getting into my ultimate end goals. And while it may seem rash to spill such long term plans in a public forum like this, that's one reason I'm starting here in my beloved Torque Community instead of blasting it out to the whole world yet. In the end, though, you really can't create an open source project in secret, can you?

I'm looking for feedback of all sorts at this point, including:

  1. Does this project interest you?
  2. Would you use this technology in a game or other virtual reality project, with a separate standalone World Server application?
  3. Would you use this technology if it could be designed without the extra application opening up, or with it happening less obviously?
  4. Would you participate in the multiverse sandbox environment described above, and if so would you pay a fee for special privileges like being able to create your own "layers"?
  5. If this was an open source project, would you join it and contribute code and resources to improve it?
  6. Finally, and perhaps most importantly, would you consider contributing to an indiegogo campaign or in some other way be willing to help finance the effort to make any or all of these things happen?
Because that is where this is going... I have intentionally bitten off a lot more than I can personally chew this time, and I fully intend to put it out to the world as a project worthy of your contributions. If it takes off, it could be the biggest thing I ever do for the internet. But first, I need to convince a lot of people that I'm on the right track. This blog is my first official attempt in that direction.

Oh yeah, before I forget... as a reward for making it all the way to the end of this blog, how about a LINK? Yes, it's true, the project is already past the point of pure vaporware and into the zone where I have an actual download. Be warned, however - it is limited to the area around Eugene at the moment, it is slow, it is full of programmer art and stock GUIs from the Unity Advanced Multiplayer Kit, and it is stocked with only the ultra-low resolution default FlightGear terrain, which at 90m is obviously far too low for a first person game. This is all fixable, given more time to throw at it.

Finally... sorry Torque users, but the first version that works well enough to share is the Unity3D version. However, here are a couple of screenshots to prove that it is almost working in Torque. I could have kept going and fixed everything, but I thought I should test the waters here to see if anyone is even interested before spending many more hours on the Torque version.

www.brokeassgames.com/blogs/chris/FGWorldServer/WorldServerTorque001S.400.jpgwww.brokeassgames.com/blogs/chris/FGWorldServer/WorldServerTorque002NE.400.jpg

Anyway, about those links! There are actually two files to download: a fairly large (450M) file which contains the FlightGear end of things, and then a much smaller (40M) Unity client for Windows.

The FlightGear side is here:

www.brokeassgames.com/MMOKit/FGWorldServer.zip

Sorry for the hoops to jump through, but the install process at this point is a little awkward. You need to make a shortcut to /bin/fgfs.exe after you unzip that file, and then give it the following command line arguments:

--fg-root="..minimal_fgdata" --aircraft=UFO --lat=44.02 --lon=-123.082 --altitude=800.0 --heading=0.0 --disable-splash-screen

Once you have that working, it should bring up a square flightgear window, 800x800 pixels in size. You may want to press F10 to get rid of the menu before proceeding. If you are doing this at night, Oregon time, then you will want to go to Environment->Time Settings first, and set the time to something with daylight.

Next, you will need to unzip the Unity side:

www.brokeassgames.com/MMOKit/MMOKitClient.windows.zip

This should be fairly straightforward, just run the MMOKitClient.exe. In order to use the demo, please make a new account with a valid email, and click through the required character-generation screen (the skills etc. don't actually do anything but you have to allocate them all in order to proceed). If all goes well you should end up with a character standing on a hill in South Eugene. Terrain and skybox refreshes should happen automatically but you can hit the 'p' key to force them.

Good luck! There is much that could go wrong (again, v0.001) but if by chance it all works and you get in, please let me know!

If you have less stomach for bleeding edges, feel free to wait a while until some of the bugs are worked out.

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EDIT: (5/31) Speaking of bugs getting worked out, there is a new download available on this project! I'm going to leave the above downloads as they are, for archive/comparison purposes, but the new version of the unity project is here:

www.brokeassgames.com/MMOKit/MMOKitClient.02.windows.zip

You can use the same flightgear download as above, but you'll need to drop three files into it to update it to the new version. You can find them here:

www.brokeassgames.com/MMOKit/FGWorldServer.patch.zip

Inside that are two directories, "bin" and "minimal_fgdata". Inside the bin directory is a new fgfs.exe, which you'll want to put in your FlightGearWorldServer/bin directory, and in the minimal_fgdata are two xml files, which you'll want to drop into your FlightGearWorldServer/minimal_fgdata directory.

There are two major changes made by this update, one for skybox image creation and the other for terrain loading.

For skyboxes, previously I was forced to move the camera five times in flightgear and take five pictures, which was very, very slow. Now I've figured out how to set up five simultaneous camera views in flightgear and render them to one very wide window and then I chop apart the single huge screenshot into five pieces, all in one operation. MUCH faster. Still not realtime or anything, you will notice the lag, but it's not as horrendous as it was.

For terrain, in the interests of space efficiency I was previously having flightgear look up and replace the same nine terrain storage files as the player moved around... but with the terrain lookup also being terribly slow, I decided to trade some space for speed and cache the data instead, under tile latitude/longitude coordinates. Now when you move around over terrain you've already seen, it should reload fairly quickly, and only drag on the edges of your known universe.

More news upcoming, but that will be in another blog...

Page «Previous 1 2 3 4 Last »
#1
05/07/2013 (3:05 pm)
First! :-)

I'm in.
#2
05/07/2013 (3:32 pm)
Unfortunately I can't say I'm interested in any substantial way, but this is very cool! Great blog too. It's certainly pretty ground-breaking stuff... I hope you manage to work out a solution that works for you!
#3
05/07/2013 (7:35 pm)
This is definitely something Id look into.
#4
05/07/2013 (8:47 pm)
I like your idea of "playing in their own terrain"--one of the things which got me to look at Defiance recently was idly scrolling through massively.com and stopping to actually pay attention to the endless scroll of games because I... recognized a freeway exit sign just over the hill from where I live in a screenshot.

#5
05/07/2013 (9:51 pm)
Thanks everyone! Yeah, I've been playing with this stuff for months now, but it still kind of never gets old, flying and running around in your own "neighborhood". Even though what I have online in this first offering is centered on Eugene, FlightGear has a utility called TerraSync which pages out terrain to a client no matter where they are, so if you wanted to run around your own local area using what I've uploaded here, it would be possible with some downloading and some research.

There is also a separate repository called fgdata (FlightGear Data) which contains ALL the data for all of FlightGear, but I think it weighs in at something approaching 20G. If anyone is very interested in this project, I invite you to go ahead and peruse the FlightGear.org site, and their forums, and download and build and experiment to your heart's content.

Just don't go out on their forums asking how to use it for your game - they're kind of particular about the fact that what they have is a "simulation" and they don't like the word "game" very much. :-)
#6
05/07/2013 (11:26 pm)
Okay, in case anyone is _really_ interested in stumbling around in my half-written Torque version, you can now download it from that T3DTerrainMaster repository:

http://github.com/ChrisCalef/T3DTerrainMaster

*WARNING* this is very much unfinished code - paging does not work yet, and terrains below 256x256 don't work either, which means _very_ slow flightgear processing. I'm only posting this for the chance enthusiast who absolutely can't wait another minute.

If you clone that whole thing and then go to Templates/Full/Full.exe, after starting your World Server (the 450M flightgear download) it should open up Torque. If you go to Empty Room.mis, it should put you into a world server environment. Keep an eye on your flightgear window and its accompanying console to see if anything is happening - even if everything works, it will appear to hang from the Torque window until all the terrain and skybox production is finished.

There is a "Terrain Master" object called theTM in EmptyRoom.mis. You can call on this from the console in two ways: theTM.ping() will tell the world server our current position, and theTM.reloadSkybox() will force a skybox image reload. Unfortunately you currently have to do this twice before seeing actual results, the first time it only complains about the files being different. :-p
#7
05/08/2013 (12:00 pm)
Since I'm a GG employee, I should curb my normally colorful language. So I will use an alternative saying:

Frackin' Awesome


I'm always amazed at the tech you come up with Chris. This should be considered blog of the month, if we had such a thing.

Quote:Does this project interest you?
IMMENSELY

Quote:Would you use this technology in a game or other virtual reality project, with a separate standalone World Server application?
Currently, no. I'm stuck in 2D world so this is not applicable to my current projects. If I was working on my 3D game idea, absolutely.

Quote:Would you use this technology if it could be designed without the extra application opening up, or with it happening less obviously?
For development, this doesn't matter to me. It's more about the end-user. If they can run the game or simulation without a second application opening up, that is ideal.

Quote:Would you participate in the multiverse sandbox environment described above, and if so would you pay a fee for special privileges like being able to create your own "layers"?
More than likely. It depends on the level of interaction and fidelity. I would love to just take my avatar to Skinner' Butte in Eugene, Oregon. Then I would just hang out there and wait for someone else to show up to have a discussion about how awesome Oregon is. MASSIVE bonus points for Oculus Rift support.

Quote:If this was an open source project, would you join it and contribute code and resources to improve it?
It depends on what would be needed. If you are looking for art, you won't get anything from me. If you want testing, count me in 100%. If you are looking for coding, I probably won't be much use since I'm maxed out on tasks. I can certainly draw a crowd, though.

Quote:Finally, and perhaps most importantly, would you consider contributing to an indiegogo campaign or in some other way be willing to help finance the effort to make any or all of these things happen?
Yes. I can probably donate some of my own cash, but there is also the potential of getting this in front of investors based on my humble connections.
#8
05/08/2013 (12:38 pm)
Hey Mich,

Thanks for the enthusiastic response! BTW I followed your lead and made my first post on r/gamedev be about this project. Feel free to give it an upvote:

http://redd.it/1dy184

Re: your humble connections, by all means let's talk!

I would love to get funded to keep working on this, and I believe there are many possible ways it could be useful in the world. There are also MANY potential low-hanging improvements - such as OpenStreetMap.org, from which we could download vector based streetmaps for practically everywhere...

The list goes on and on. Keep me posted if any angels get interested!

EDIT: BTW, the current fidelity may not be all you could wish for - we're rocking 90m terrain data at the moment - but 10m is very much possible and the first thing on the list of improvements, when I get to it. (Skinner Butte looks a lot better in 10m of course, I'd recommend Spencer Butte for hanging out at the moment.) However, your dream of sitting around waiting for someone to show up is very much possible already - that sample Unity download is hooked up to my smartfox server on the Amazon Cloud, so you and a friend can already go chat about how awesome Eugene is!

If you don't have a friend with you it will probably be a long wait, however, the virtual world isn't exactly swarming at the moment. :-)

RE-EDIT: Also, re: 2D world, you might even be surprised there... you could generate a backdrop for a 2D game using this application, just by ignoring the other four screenshots and moving the player along a line, or between predefined world positions that have good views, just as an example. (You could even take a one-dimensional terrain height sample and run your player over the cascades as a side scroller, if you wanted to get really crazy!)

One could also use this system to save out skyboxes in advance, and then use them for specific positions in a rails sort of game without having to run the second app live. Or, possibly save a whole load of skyboxes for a limited area, and then switch between them as the player moves around, as another way to get rid of the 2nd app. Options are endless...
#9
05/08/2013 (4:43 pm)
Here's a relevant question for any Torque expert out there: is it possible to render a Torque window in such a way that part of the screen is transparent right through to the desktop? (Or, through to another application running literally behind the Torque window?) Just wondering...
#10
05/08/2013 (8:53 pm)
I think this is kinda funny, cause this is the main reason why I wanted to work with Torque 3D (it being open source and all.0 If you look at my only posts, it is about world rendering, soon followed with posts that don't quite help move anything forward. I have done countless hours of research on the subject, but alas I'm not a programmer (although about to complete a game design course which is ending with basic java coding.) I would love to join this cause as an artist, I have tons and tons of models collected over the years of whole cities such as San Francisco, Chicago, New York and others. I had an virtually the same idea as you as far as layering your own game over the planet model. Recently (a couple months ago,) an open source planet rendering program I've been following has released their work to the public, I've only downloaded the binaries, by far, the best open source planet sim I have come across ( http://proland.inrialpes.fr/index.html .) Seeing is believing (page has videos). But yeah, I would love to join your efforts on this on the art side, also if you'd like, check out my post on the subject, there are links to more similar open source projects!!
#11
05/09/2013 (9:38 am)
Right on, Agent, I'll be glad to have your help. What format are your city models in?

Proland looks very interesting, not sure if it will specifically help me or not but I'll have to keep an eye on it. It definitely looks more like a more beautiful rendering solution than what FlightGear does so far, but the rest of the flightgear infrastructure and accumulated work (such as many people customizing their own cities) as well as their TerraSync terrain server, etc. make FG a more ready solution for me. Plus, of course, the airplanes. :-)

I guess the appropriate thing at this point would be for me to start compiling a mailing list of interested volunteers... so anybody reading this, if you want to help, please send me an email at chris at brokeassgames.com, and let me know what your skillset & resources are, as well as perhaps how much time you might have to put in and what your primary interest in the project is.

Thanks!
#12
05/09/2013 (11:31 am)
Also, just to throw it out there: in terms of actual content, the core of this entire project is really going to revolve around the set of FlightGear scenery files. These are constructed from height data and GIS shapefiles. I believe QGIS is the free GIS app of choice among most of the developers there. But anyone who is going to want to help on the level of adding content would do well to start by downloading my flightgear install, and then beginning the learning curve on flightgear.org to figure out the whole process involved in generating terrain.

Here is a great forum to start looking around in:
http://flightgear.org/forums/viewforum.php?f=5

No matter what direction the final product ends up going, the stored data format is most likely to be some version of what FG is using today. This is the main reason I decided to release a client early, even if it's a little awkward - just so I can have a working base in which artists and content providers can start accumulating work immediately. That way, even if it takes another six months to come up with a client that satisfies all my needs, interested people could be working on their content the whole time.
#13
05/09/2013 (11:34 am)
Yesterday I had an email conversation with an interested party, during the course of which I clarified a number of points that may be of interest to people here as well.


>how does this Terrain Master thing work?

Well, it is currently a half-finished morph between what it was and what it is turning into... what it was originally was a paging system that reads data from a binary height data file, created in 3DEM by combining several DEM maps. That's more or less explained in the first blog on the subject, lemme know if you have specific questions about that.

The new thing that you just downloaded if you cloned the project today is the halfway morphed over version of that which, instead of reading all the data from one big file, reads nine little files, one for each terrain tile in a 3x3 grid. It also has nine equivalent texture index data files, which reference (via U8 indices) whatever textures are loaded in those slots on your terrain tiles.

As the player moves through the world, the same nine terrain blocks are shifted around in a TerrainLayout[3][3] array, reloading height and texture data and changing position as necessary to keep the player always in the center tile, minus a slight buffer area. This is the part that works fine in Unity but isn't there in Torque yet, and I got too frustrated trying to fix it by the fact that I am also limited to minimum 256x256 terrains in Torque for some reason (crashing on anything smaller). The flightgear height sampling method I'm (probably naively) using is extremely slow already with only 64x64 terrains, and now it's 16 times slower... so if you had any inclination to help me out, that would be a great place to start! :-)
#14
05/09/2013 (11:37 am)
>ok, so that works for terrain, but how are you/it handling models and AI?

I'm not, yet.

For my first pass at that, I'm planning on using the FlightGear scenery system as the authoritative source of all models. They already have a simple text-file-based system where each terrain tile has an accompanying text file listing all models and their position/orientation data. This will of course get inefficient as hell under any kind of scale, but for 0.001 it would be good enough to allow the user to start building the environment. I plan to use the world editors in Torque and Unity to place objects, and then have a "save to flightgear" button that saves everything in the level (or everything tagged with a certain tag) into the flightgear files.

FlightGear is based on OpenSceneGraph, and I've already tested loading FBX files into it, which sort of works, and can surely be fixed up to work just fine. I will probably use Ecstasy Motion to convert any DTS models I need into FBX so I can open them in FlightGear, but I'm not sure what everybody else is going to want to do. You could use Collada as an interchange format from Torque, as one example, or use the FBX API that I released a while ago from Ecstasy.

The current models already in FlightGear are in ac3d which is an obscure text based format I for one have never heard of in my life, but fortunately it's very simple and I can probably write a parser for it in a couple of days to convert those models into FBX or DTS.

Ultimately I will have to have an online database and a way to talk to it securely, but I haven't even gone there yet, there are so many options that I figured I'd just let this thing get bounced around a little before I try to make that call. The final end plan of the great Sandbox Earth project will require that all objects are part of one or more layers (maybe just an extra integer id field in the object table) - the idea being that there is one common shared "reality" layer, where everyone makes their best effort to model the real current Earth, ala Google Earth, but beyond that the multiverse kicks in, and people could reinterpret the same GIS data to turn downtown into a medieval downtown, or post apoc downtown, or My Little Pony land or whatever the hell they want.

Re: AI, it will totally depend on the application. Mostly I would imagine it will be handled on the client end, and intelligent entities probably wouldn't even exist on the server side, except as objects to place on the map. The skybox refresh is too slow at this point to do much character rendering with it anyway.
#15
05/09/2013 (11:40 am)
>how much of a rewrite is it for you to deal w T3D AND Unity at the same time?

It was a bit of a rewrite getting it to work in T3D... mostly because I had to flip and mirror the skybox images in order to fit them into the cubemap scheme Torque uses. Then figuring out winsock for C++ was of course different than sockets in linux in C++ as well as from winsock in C#...

But if you're asking about _running_ T3D and Unity at the same time, it should already be possible as long as you don't make requests at the same time (which would inevitably happen unless you carefully prevented it.

Is that what you meant?


>how detailed do you think u can get this in T3D?

As detailed as I have time and budget for... as I mentioned in a comment on the blog, OpenStreetMap.org has vector data for streetmaps all over the world, I don't know the specific licensing but I wouldn't be surprised if the models people are contributing to Google Earth might be portable as collada exports into this system...

I'm hoping that by open sourcing it and making it into an easily accessible sandbox, based in at least Torque and Unity but possibly more engines as well, that I can attract enough of a user base to A) see a significant amount of work go into it from the users, and B) monetize a BAG world server ala Second Life, with adsense and/or premium licensing, virtual real estate sales, etc.

I am most excited about the possibility of turning this into not just a playground but to have aspects of actual world simulation, eg by enticing grad students to use this system for visualization of their research. Specifically I could imagine far more detail in terms of specific vegetation distribution, as well as things like urban planning visualization, etc. I'd really like it to be a catch-all shared framework for any real Earth related virtual content.

The idea is that all the complexity should live in the FlightGear world, as the abstract "server" in the clouds, so to speak, and then Torque and Unity are left with the job of rendering only the local area and any moving parts. I would like Torque and Unity users to be able to walk up to each other in world and not even know they aren't using the same client, in a perfect world. (As second life has multiple client options for the same shared game world.)

>how much TorqueScript do u use in this implementation?

basically none, it's pretty much all in C++ at this point.
#16
05/09/2013 (7:24 pm)
I would be very interested :D

As for Pledges and the like. Where do I sign up?
#17
05/09/2013 (8:01 pm)
I can't begin to describe how much this post made me dream about the possibilities. Post-Apocalyptic game using real-world data? F*** Yeah.

As Mich pointed out, this + Occulus Rift = major win.

It's always been awesome to see your progress with the Terrain Paging system and this feels like a major breakthrough along those lines.

Do Keep it up!
#18
05/09/2013 (8:54 pm)
Thanks! Re: pledges, etc. I have quite worked out the whole plan yet but I'll probably put together an indiegogo project for it. Will keep you posted.
#19
05/09/2013 (9:16 pm)
@Chris Calef - I Would be willing to help out where needed :)

I am a 3D Artist that wants to get involved in a project like this. If you would like to hear me out shoot me an email.

I have some experience with Crowdfunding Campaigns. So please let me know if you would like some help :)

- Ben
#20
05/09/2013 (10:00 pm)
Hey Benjamin,

I don't see an email address on your profile... can you send me an email to chris at brokeassgames.com, so I can put you on the mailing list?
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