Why should I choose T3D over TGEA
by Lou Lessing · in General Discussion · 06/20/2009 (4:10 pm) · 7 replies
I am developing a first person puzzle game (Think Myst 5, gameplay-wise. Graphically it will probably be a bit worse, but it should be quite pretty.) I am quite possibly going to write it in Torque. Now, I have a few questions.
1. Why, precisely, should I pay an extra seven hundred dollars for T3D, other than "it's better?" It has a few tools that could prove useful, but what is better about the engine? Am I paying 700 bucks for a river and road editor and a material editor I won't use, because I'm using Mental Mill, or is the engine significantly better optimized? Whats new under the hood?
2. While we're on the subject, I can import shaders from other formats (hlsl, glsl) right? I'm not stuck with a diffuse-specular-normal phong shader, am I?
3. Do the tools for TGEA work with T3D (ArcaneFX, GreenEar, Cirrus Skies, GameMechanics, etc?) I would expect that some do, but not most. Still, which do?
4. T3D has that video of a rain effect. Is that just... doable? Can I just use that system? Is it built in? Do I need to buy it again? Is it just to illustrate the power of the engine, to show that it can be done, but to do it I would need to rewrite it myself (well beyond my capabilities)?
5. I am part of a very small dev team (two people) with no money. How much harm would it do our workflow in T3D if one of us was on Basic and the other on Pro? (I know Basic won't be released until 1.0.) I am primarily an artist and he is primarily a coder, but we both do a little of both.
6. Is there a student license available? I'm technically a student, and I'm dead bloody broke, so I figure it's worth asking.
1. Why, precisely, should I pay an extra seven hundred dollars for T3D, other than "it's better?" It has a few tools that could prove useful, but what is better about the engine? Am I paying 700 bucks for a river and road editor and a material editor I won't use, because I'm using Mental Mill, or is the engine significantly better optimized? Whats new under the hood?
2. While we're on the subject, I can import shaders from other formats (hlsl, glsl) right? I'm not stuck with a diffuse-specular-normal phong shader, am I?
3. Do the tools for TGEA work with T3D (ArcaneFX, GreenEar, Cirrus Skies, GameMechanics, etc?) I would expect that some do, but not most. Still, which do?
4. T3D has that video of a rain effect. Is that just... doable? Can I just use that system? Is it built in? Do I need to buy it again? Is it just to illustrate the power of the engine, to show that it can be done, but to do it I would need to rewrite it myself (well beyond my capabilities)?
5. I am part of a very small dev team (two people) with no money. How much harm would it do our workflow in T3D if one of us was on Basic and the other on Pro? (I know Basic won't be released until 1.0.) I am primarily an artist and he is primarily a coder, but we both do a little of both.
6. Is there a student license available? I'm technically a student, and I'm dead bloody broke, so I figure it's worth asking.
#2
06/20/2009 (4:33 pm)
you can use TGE 1.52 too if you dont need shaders...
#3
06/20/2009 (4:36 pm)
Shaders are my reason for migrating to Torque. It's currently about three percent out of concept as a Source engine mod. 
#4
2. Yes, you can create your own HLSL shaders (GLSL on the Mac version).
3. Since it's still in beta, most things don't yet work. The Game Mechanics Kit does. ArcaneFX is being updated, but not ready. There is a new sky in T3D called "ScatterSky", so perhaps you won't need Cirrus Skies, but I don't know. Beyond that. I do know know about GreenEar.
4. There is a precipitation object built in to the editor. No need to code it yourself.
5. According to GG's posts, It is allowed for you to share your enhanced executables with enhanced lighting (etc), with your artists. So this is fine.
6. I doubt it, but I don't work here. You just missed the 200 dollar discount, but you can still get a 100 dollar discount right now. If you already own TGEA, then you can get the full price discounted off T3D.
All in all, I like T3D. It's the engine we all hoped in our dreams we would get, and now it's finally coming true.
06/20/2009 (5:52 pm)
1. The new renderer is faster than TGEA. The material editor is much handier than you realize - You can make your material externally, and then tune it to get it just right. The roads, terrains, rivers, and physics are new, you're just not getting an editor. 2. Yes, you can create your own HLSL shaders (GLSL on the Mac version).
3. Since it's still in beta, most things don't yet work. The Game Mechanics Kit does. ArcaneFX is being updated, but not ready. There is a new sky in T3D called "ScatterSky", so perhaps you won't need Cirrus Skies, but I don't know. Beyond that. I do know know about GreenEar.
4. There is a precipitation object built in to the editor. No need to code it yourself.
5. According to GG's posts, It is allowed for you to share your enhanced executables with enhanced lighting (etc), with your artists. So this is fine.
6. I doubt it, but I don't work here. You just missed the 200 dollar discount, but you can still get a 100 dollar discount right now. If you already own TGEA, then you can get the full price discounted off T3D.
All in all, I like T3D. It's the engine we all hoped in our dreams we would get, and now it's finally coming true.
#5
Also, how customizable is the precipitation object?
We have a lot of water in our game, including one prominent underwater cavern, so water looking good is a bit of a priority.
06/20/2009 (10:21 pm)
And the precipitation object looks as good (on a top-end system) as it does in that video? Also, how customizable is the precipitation object?
We have a lot of water in our game, including one prominent underwater cavern, so water looking good is a bit of a priority.
#6
06/21/2009 (5:11 pm)
Which video are you referring to? 
#7
AFAIK, Gerhard's wetness shader isn't yet included in Torque 3D but I figure it will be in an upcoming beta.
Generally, even if you don't use some specific new features of Torque 3D, there is a lot going for the engine at a more fundamental level. The editors have seen a lot of improvement (IMO, the upcoming B3 has some really amazing and long awaited stuff as part of the standard editor toolset) and there's been a lot of improvements at the rendering and lighting level including a deferred renderer with full real-time lighting.
6. I may be wrong, but I think GG never directly offered student versions but rather provided academic licenses only through institutions.
06/22/2009 (6:10 am)
AFAIK, Gerhard's wetness shader isn't yet included in Torque 3D but I figure it will be in an upcoming beta.
Generally, even if you don't use some specific new features of Torque 3D, there is a lot going for the engine at a more fundamental level. The editors have seen a lot of improvement (IMO, the upcoming B3 has some really amazing and long awaited stuff as part of the standard editor toolset) and there's been a lot of improvements at the rendering and lighting level including a deferred renderer with full real-time lighting.
6. I may be wrong, but I think GG never directly offered student versions but rather provided academic licenses only through institutions.
Torque 3D Owner Sean H.
Brett has said as much on a few occasions.