What's wrong with Unity?

#41

Quote:plus with Torque you get the source code, so you can implement new feature when you need to, you don't have to wait for their staff to fix the bug for you.

With torque you need the source code, as the staff doesn't fix bugs they wait for the community to do it then claim credit.

With Unity, it's a different paradigm. It's a game engine framework who's classes are exposed through a DLL. In this framework, unlike Torque, everything advertised works properly out of the box. Anything you need beyond that, there's C++ or .Net assembly plugins and direct access to a GL class for you. The source code, written by you in C#, Javascript or Boo, interfaces with this framework.

If you think about it, what GG is trying to do with T3D is become more like Unity in it's architecture.

Quote:Just the fact that PhysX is implemented with networking is a HUGE difference.

Doesn't GG claim that TGEA has PhysX too? Oh wait that's right there's a thread where the community is bitching and complaining about that, being that it's based off a broken community resource. Btw, the physics engine in Unity is fully supported with the networking engine, something the broken community resource GG claims as a feature never did.

The real test for which engine is better for indies, is by looking at who's making money. All those indie developers making a living with their games, whether through shockwave, Iphone, self publishing etc. Do you actually want to make and publish games, or fret over how to chop apart this FPS source you bought and retrofit it into a simple puzzle game?

I'm glad I ditched the abortion that is GG for Unity. When Unity 2.5 comes out with windows authoring and people actually give it a spin, it'll be a ghost town around here.

#42 Boo, is that some ghost writer script language? is it compatible with apparition plugins? I cant believe this thread is still going... So many thread that could have productive outcomes- yet here this one is.

Unity looks realy cool, but I have a office full of PCs and when i click Unitys DEMO download link its a mac file. So im not impressed. If its cross platform they could at LEAST demo its PC abilitys.

The people that enjoy Unity so much should go create games with Unity. Same with Torque. Stop talking about what one is best, and DO something to prove it.

Words are spoken all across the globe, it is actions that prove motive.

#43
If your going to comment on things, please at least do some research.

Boo is one of the 3 scripting languages that you can use with Unity, it is based on Python syntax afaik.

Unity 2.5 is soon to be released, this includes a new Windows IDE and some slight changes to license, meaning you will be able to publish for both Windows and Mac with the Indie license.

Anyone I've picked my engine (C4) so I'll stop watching these threads i guess :P

#44 also I wonder why so many people trying to defend Unity engine in GG forum,
i don't see a need for this, i never see GG staff running around trying to defend Torque engine in
Unity forum or other game dev forum, this is because GG staff is busy spending their time
to focus on improving the website and the documentation.
not wasting their time to debate/promote how good Torque engine on other people's forum.

#45
What does it have to do with Staff? I don't work for unity, I don't think anyone here does?

People are trying to choose what engine is best for them, of course they are going to talk about different engines on different forums. The noticeable lack of community members defending Torque on other forums may or may not mean something.

The only reason I was posting here originally is because I was deciding between three engines, I'm not even using Unity, but it is nice to get the facts out in the open so that people can make more informed decisions.

#46 Boo. Humor is lost. Dose that scare you? I use Torque because its funny! Unity sounds scary, and sorts like a cult.... A scary cult, BOO! How esoteric.

#47 fights in a forum. :P people should just go back where they belong which is with there engine. stop wasting time fighting and make your games. that's the reason why they come over here to fight as they got nothing better to do its why i bet caylo don't even have a game yet if he as one it cant a good one.

#48 people should just go back where they belong
Ya, and we should put up fences to keep them there!

Im sorry, im just dicking with ya. All my putters are rendering and i got nothing better to do. I got game! So much game i dont even need to brag about it. and im so lazy im not even gonna capitalize this sentence or use punctuation and just let it run on and on and on

#49

Quote:i don't see a need for this, i never see GG staff running around trying to defend Torque engine in
Unity forum or other game dev forum, this is because GG staff is busy spending their time
to focus on improving the website and the documentation.

You must not have looked very hard, Andrew. David Blake has been over there quite a bit recently. I'm also glad they're actually going about providing adequate documentation. Of course, you could also argue it's something they should have done years ago.

Quote:fights in a forum. :P people should just go back where they belong which is with there engine.

That's quite ironic, Brandon. I notice it doesn't say 'Torque Owner' next to your name. It does next to mine and all the other people I saw in this thread saying Unity is a far better product.

#50 @ Jacobin

I'm not sure I've seen more than maybe two people claiming Unity is a better product. Most have been saying their both good, and both have pro's and con's.

As far as David Blake, he can be found on multiple game engine forums because he works with multiple engines. It has nothing to do with Torque verses Unity or anything else. Placing David in that light is unfair and frankly, untrue.

For me this whole argument is irrelevant and serves no purpose. If I had to bet, I'd say the same applies for most here, including Staples who has already stated he choose neither.

#51 It is a good thing I'm not a moderator here. I would have locked this thread on day one, page one, post one, as these types of threads serve no purpose eccept to enflame.

My suggestion:
Look at both engines, find the one that suits you and work with it. If you find it doesn't work, and you can't make it work for you, then find another engine.

Fighting over "which engine is better" is a useless waste of time and passion.

Just cool off and go make a fun game we can all play.

#52 @ Brett:
That 54 buick comment wasn't meant badly..alot of people like old cars "sooped" up with new features. Erm..I guess no matter how I say that it sounds bad but I meant it as good.

About this:

Quote:There's a reason why Unity's all alone in the world of binary development tools.

I license a few binary development tools, look around, they do exist! Use Lawmaker as one example.

@all:
I didn't mean to sound harsh before..but I don't think these 2 engines should be compared. That's all I really meant to say, but NY'er style(abrupt and with mountains of metaphors).
- I like TGEA and Unity...but Unity is not for the Windows development platform, so TGEA wins in my book. .. . .Unity 2.5 will have windows support but I would guess that it will be sorta-bugged until their next major revision(this stuff just happens). So T3D is in my focal-range. If Unity 2.5/3.0 is as nice as most claim, then I guess I will have to utilize both.

Once again:
I don't think these 2 engines should be compared. ;)
But then again, I am just a game dev from NY, who cares what I think.
:P + :D

#53 I love this thread. As I have bought the Torque engine, its good to hear both sides.
Just so I'm clear on this, the Unity engine does not include source code? And if it does not,.. why buy an engine without source code?... dlls? Dlls?.. if they are your compiler, than you cannot compile anything or develop your own software, right? So basically you are not buying an "engine". They still have the rights to it.
I've been doing games for over ten yrs, and we have programmers at every angle. How do you add AI, or how do you add more code to an engine that is already compiled by someone else that does not provide you with the source code? Please tell me the Unity engine gives you the source code, ?
thx

#54 lol you don't get source code they build the engine the way they want it not you. if the engine us missing 1 thing well you better complain and complain till they add what ever it is your missing. unity is a bad engine i would not recommend it to anyone how many good games you see with that engine i don't see non.

#55 Brandon, who are you? You seem very opinionated for someone who doesn't own any Toruqe licences.

#56 i will be owning a torque engine soon i have been looking at engines for some time and have decided on tgea. i don't own it yet as i will be leaving soon for about a week but when i come back i will be buying it. i just been reading the forums allot and just gathering stuff wile i wait i also working on things that will be put in the engine. i don't think i will be using tgea much once t3d comes out i will be buying that and using it as my engine. i still want tgea just in case i need it.

#57 @Brandon
Unity is not a bad engine by any means. Neither is NeoAxis, GameCore, Lawmaker, A7, GameMaker, irrlicht, Sauerbraten, id Tech 1/2/3/etc, C4, etc. I've used all of them, and I do not find any of them to be "bad" engines. All engines have stronger and weaker featuresets. For example, A7's networking really is not that great and their script organization is a bit murky at times, however, they make up for it by providing a strong toolset for developers making games with the engine. And the tools, as much as I dislike MED, work nicely with the engine.

If you are going to call out engines as "bad", then provide solid reasoning why you have made a decision not to license them. A very good topic came up on the Unity forum about reasons that a user decided to choose Shiva over Unity for iPhone publishing. While there were definitely some heated moments in the topic, the op's reasoning behind not picking up a Unity license was extremely well-thought-out and supported by their decision-making criteria. There were a number of people in the topic with very different criteria (and in fact, the topic came to talk more about various points in the criteria than it did about the op's full topic). To those people, certain criteria with what they get in Unity fit their model very, very well. While the op's criteria, Shiva fit well.

Don't discount something because you're not using it. Try to support arguments about the decision-making process. You've noted several times that you've looked at a ton of engines before choosing Torque. Use that research to back up the claims that are being made. You've done the research, now show us why you chose Torque instead of just calling an engine "bad" or that it "sucks".

I consider the topic I referred to on Unity's forums good because it brings up extremely helpful criticism in a very reputable way that the UT guys can make use of. They may disagree, they may not use it, but it provides them with productive feedback to their engine and licensing scenarios as to why one team chose a competitor. Other people in the topic also provided them with great feedback on why they have chosen Unity over a competitor. The dialogue created was beneficial on both sides of the argument.

EDIT: clarification because I revised two sentences into one that really made no sense!

#58 ya i read that topic. i have looked at over 200 engines from free to mill dollar engines the mill dollar engines are out of my league though. i looked unity don't have source so that why that one is all out bad. i wanted a engine that is easy to use and has a strong community so if i need help i can ask for it and get the help i need. gg has the community and the engine is easy to use i have not read documentation and i still know my way around the engine. i will be reading documentation though to learn its code but i will do that when i own the engine. i also been looking at the new stuff coming out with t3d that will make there engine even better i don't mind a price change.

if i was to pick a engine it would be HeroEngine it looks easy to use end got many things that many games need. i have looked at c4 as well as its a competitor of gg from what people say but its editors are hard to use its not worth the time. the only thing i think tgea lack is being able to import things unity has easy import future and i like that but that will soon change with t3d. i also picked a torque engine because i see them moving forward allot more then these other engines to make things easier for us to build games.

i think i can go on for ever saying whats good and whats bad to the reason why i picked torque as i have don't so much research to find a engine that is right for me i would have to talk about + and - points about every engine i have gone though and like i said that's over 200 engines. there are also reasons for picking gg is that its made for more then 1 game i want to build more then 1 game till i have the money to build the main game i want to build which is not easy and not cheap. i could just go and start on the main game i want to build first but if i did that i think it would take me 10-20 years to do it with the money i have now. so i want to slim that down allot with these games i will be making.

i not going to be talking about what game i am building first not right now maybe in 6 months i will be ready to show something. i like to keep things on a low lvl of people knowing as i know people can just take your ideas and produce just about the same game i don't want that happening. i have told a total of 4 people what i am doing but i tell them very limited info i just tell them a quick overview of what i am building. this will be my first game so it will take longer then the next ones as i still have to learn code and stuff but after #1 game i will know allot to be able to move faster one the next ones.

#59
You might want to change the words you are using Brandon.

Unity doesn't have the source code which makes it unsuitable for your project, but does not, in any way, make it a bad engine.

Also I'd be interested to hear what you found difficult in the C4 editor? I found it pretty easy actually, and more flexible than the Torque editor, the Scene Graph is great to work with. There are a couple of things that you need to learn, but nothing that makes it difficult.

Anyhow just be careful how you say things, saying "Unity is all out bad" is simply not true and will give people the wrong impression.

#60 Actually Jacobin, the staff does provide fixes for the engines.

/The more you know!