Vs2008&xna3 support?
by Ronan Thibaudau · in Torque X 2D · 08/18/2008 (1:00 pm) · 7 replies
Hello there , been hearing about the torque engine forever as i read gamedev.net forums a lot but never wanted to dig too deep into C++ so torque X is sounding like a perfect match for me to get started doing games with an artist friend (i'm a C# programmer) . I see that xna3 CTP is out and adds support for vs2008 (but no xbox support) and was wondering if torque x would work out of the box on it (or if there was support planned for it down the road) . It's not a deal breaker in any case just wondering if i should revert to vs2005 or wait a bit & go for xna3/2008 if it's planned.
Thanks for your help.
Thanks for your help.
#2
08/18/2008 (6:53 pm)
I'm a bit confused as of to what i should buy , the pro licence costs more than the builder , does it means it includes it? Or do i need both the pro licence and the 3D builder X to have everything i need? That is i want both the ability to code & WYSWIG (also how does the builder work if it's separated , i mean does it just generate C# code? If so can't i mod that instead of getting the pro licence if i don't wanna mod the engine only code for it?) 
#3
John K.
08/18/2008 (8:44 pm)
The builders (2D and 3D) are separate from the engine source. They are standalone level editors that write to an XML-based level definition file. They work perfectly with the FREE binary version of Torque X. You most likely won't need the Pro version right away, unless you want to dig into Engine code. Also, there is a 30 day trial for the builders, so you can first play around with them befire comitting to a purchase. As for XNA 3.0 support, it is on the roadmap as Sean mentioned, but not until after XNA 3.0 is released with full Xbox 360 support.John K.
#4
Engine Dll= free for now.
Engine code= pro licence (150$ for indi)
Builder (can be used alone with the runtime)
So the builder exports to xml , how is the code ran afterward? A premade binary that parses the .xml file or is there code generation somewhere down the line where i can modify behavior? That is use the builder for the level building /some scripting and then totally mod other aspects of the game in C#?
Also if i get the pro licence and do dig in the engine code and make interface breaking change , i assume the builder won't work anymore for obvious reasons , is there a way to get the builder source somewhere down the line (for a fee like for the engine source) so i can mod the engine but still use the builder?
Really appreciate the helpfull answers.
08/19/2008 (2:44 am)
I understand. Sorry for asking so many questions but i like to be sure before i buy because , even thought torque X looke like it's very cheap for what it is (thanks for that!) , it's still rather expensive for me in the absolute so i just want to be sure what i'm getting into.Engine Dll= free for now.
Engine code= pro licence (150$ for indi)
Builder (can be used alone with the runtime)
So the builder exports to xml , how is the code ran afterward? A premade binary that parses the .xml file or is there code generation somewhere down the line where i can modify behavior? That is use the builder for the level building /some scripting and then totally mod other aspects of the game in C#?
Also if i get the pro licence and do dig in the engine code and make interface breaking change , i assume the builder won't work anymore for obvious reasons , is there a way to get the builder source somewhere down the line (for a fee like for the engine source) so i can mod the engine but still use the builder?
Really appreciate the helpfull answers.
#5
My opinions....
Are you going to be doing 3d or 2d?
I think that TX 2d is pretty robust and a 2d game is pretty attainable - the 2d starterkit is certainly a good start. The source is certainly useful - however not a requirement for initial development.
Both the 2d and the 3d builders just create XML files for you and the engine uses them via serialization, standard C# development - modification of the source would not immediately rule their usefulness or use out - in fact I doubt that it would - you would have to make a significant change in the source and the paradigm that makes TX what it is. I dont think they will release the source for the builders - that is really a john question however.
I think that the 3d portion is not quite as robust yet - there has been rumors of a release, that may make it better. I think the one key thing that I hope to see is skinned model support - this is pretty critical for game dev. I must say however, deployment of the FPS (it did require the source, because the fixes are not yet out) to an xbox was pretty impressive and no XNA engine to date can do so (blade3d, visual3d.net etc)
Sean
08/19/2008 (8:33 pm)
Ronan,My opinions....
Are you going to be doing 3d or 2d?
I think that TX 2d is pretty robust and a 2d game is pretty attainable - the 2d starterkit is certainly a good start. The source is certainly useful - however not a requirement for initial development.
Both the 2d and the 3d builders just create XML files for you and the engine uses them via serialization, standard C# development - modification of the source would not immediately rule their usefulness or use out - in fact I doubt that it would - you would have to make a significant change in the source and the paradigm that makes TX what it is. I dont think they will release the source for the builders - that is really a john question however.
I think that the 3d portion is not quite as robust yet - there has been rumors of a release, that may make it better. I think the one key thing that I hope to see is skinned model support - this is pretty critical for game dev. I must say however, deployment of the FPS (it did require the source, because the fixes are not yet out) to an xbox was pretty impressive and no XNA engine to date can do so (blade3d, visual3d.net etc)
Sean
#6
John K.
08/19/2008 (11:02 pm)
Sean is spot on. Also, one more point of clarification - You will end up creating a new Game (.exe) project using one of the Torque X project templates. This is where you add most of your specific game code and this .exe will link in the Torque X .dll file. So you do not need to modify the engine source to create a new game - you just modify your own game code and call the related Torque X game engine methods as needed. Also, the builder source is not likely to be released anytime soon. But, the good news is that the next release of Torque X (coming really soon) will fix most of the bugs that Sean has pointed out. Yay! I would suggest that you go ahead and pull down the FREE version of Torque X (and the Builder) and then go through a couple tutorials to get your feet wet. John K.
#7
I'm only interested in targeting the pc (so xbox support doesn't matter to me) and 3D. I'm wondering from what you say about stability if you're only talking about the 3D builder or also the 3D part of the engine? Because if the beta builder is unstable i kinda expected that and that's not an issue but if the runtime is too well that's harder to workaround lol.
And i realise i do not need to mod the engine source john but was more of wondering in case i acutally want to do so somewhere down the line , i guess i can just avoid interface breaking changes tho.
08/20/2008 (2:54 am)
Thanks for the answers,I'm only interested in targeting the pc (so xbox support doesn't matter to me) and 3D. I'm wondering from what you say about stability if you're only talking about the 3D builder or also the 3D part of the engine? Because if the beta builder is unstable i kinda expected that and that's not an issue but if the runtime is too well that's harder to workaround lol.
And i realise i do not need to mod the engine source john but was more of wondering in case i acutally want to do so somewhere down the line , i guess i can just avoid interface breaking changes tho.
Torque Owner Sean T. Boyette
I suspect that the roadmap includes xna 3, once it is actually a non CTP product.