What is up with Microsoft Gaming?

#21 Actually, MS makes a little money from the 360 since somewhat after it came out (initially they were losing some). There are various press releases about it. Nintendo of course makes most of their cash from hardware sales, since their attach rate is abysmal.

(I didn't read through the rest of the thread, I just thought I'd make that one point.)

www.techspot.com/news/23612-microsoft-makes-tiny-profit-on-xbox-360-hardware.htm...

Quote:Through reduction in manufacturing costs, Microsoft has managed to bring the cost of the Xbox 360 to a zero loss, if not a slight profit. With a reduction in manufacturing costs by nearly 40% since the console's release and perhaps streamlining of the process and bulkier orders, a $399 pricetag now nets Microsoft $75.70...

#22 Microsoft helps the industry.. period. There are a lot of issues we could all pick and pull the best and worst.
Love or hate.

But they are good. They put food on many a table outside of there offices. Of course they have to compete.

Otherwise Suits would be just as happy to charge us 300 bucks for a Pong console just the same.

MS let's there people bring good ideas. They where one of the first companies to let people relax a bit and take the ties off. Make a nice campus and good work environment.

We owe them a lot of love. (and a little hate too but just to keep on the toes).

#23 I had my time of admiration to Microsoft.

I was very confused indeed. We dont owe MS nothing at all. Microsoft dont help the industry but itself. And Microsoft actually dont respond to people, respond to regulations, its a corporation: corporations dont take into account the world peace, nor the employees be happy, not *the better for the industry*. They see the industry in terms of nothing more than profits.

Read more about history, read more about corporations, read about personnel working at corporations. And please! read more about Microsoft.

And btw, they dont allow people to be relaxed because they are good. Its well know that the software development its a mind job, not a physical one. And they have perfectly estimated the times when the productivity per employee drop down due to stress.

I dont want you to believe me, I want you to go and inform yourself on the matter.


It keeps amazing me, how people are convinced of this kind of things so easily. In fact people defend some points without even think what they are saying or why ("the TV says so"). Very few here have an actually educated opinion, but it result useless cause they are not listened by those who are ignorant or misinformed.

Its fun to see represented here the problems of the world on a forum thread of a game programming community. "Para muestra, alcanza un boton" we say here: "For a cross-section, a button is enough ".


Edit: typos

#24 As one of those "very few people with an educated opinion" (I don't even have TV), I do like what Microsoft are doing.
They make my life as a developer better, they make many a gamer's life better, and at the same time they make money. These things aren't necessarily mutually exclusive, you know.
Obviously I don't like all of the many different things that MS are doing. Some of them are bad indeed, like the monopolistic practices that you mentioned.
However if some rules don't work, we can only blame those who make the rules, not those who use them to their own advantage... that's what anyone would do.

#25 I think the term for this type of behavior is called, "Loss/Lead"...lose money on the frontEnd; while making it on the backEnd. Standard operating procedure for some business...that's right, Kiddies; I said "business".

...for instance: when you go into a bar/tavern[assuming legally able to], and see the 'HappyHour' free snacks and such...the same concept applies to any retail product. The tavern owner is losing money on the free food; while gaining revenue by selling drinks.... So, now; seeing this behavior from another 'retailer'....is everyone hating bars/taverns or anyone else who gives free samples??

It may be computer videos 'gaming'...but 'product' is 'product'; one must not confuse the concept that doing something for money or trying to gain a greater marketShare or base is wrong. Along with computer science knowledge, I'd have to say a few courses in Marketing and Sales might be in order before 'operating' a business...?? Eh?

#26 Borland.

#27 Well I'm not trying to specifically label 1 person as an MS-hater. Apologies if I have that impression. I just meant the phenomenon of MS-hate in general is confusing to me. And I think I'm qualified to make an opinion, given I'm a professional computer engineer whose worked in industry with both Windows and Linux. And as I've stated before, I'm borderline finished with my MSEE. So it's not like I'm just a 360-lover gushing about his favorite console maker. My opinions are grounded in experience.

Again, I argue that MS is not evil. Linux has great R&D value. But I don't think, even today with SuSE/RedHat/Ubuntu, that it's as user-friendly as Windows. Nor do I think it's as easy of a platform to develop software on. Don't get me wrong, Windows in all incarnations has its flaws.... but at the end of the day, it's not the popular choice just due to massive Microsoft marketing dollars. They've simply done a good job keeping it up to date yet compatible with legacy software.

This topic, however, is about the Xbox 360. First, yes, I agree that MS is out to take on Sony and Nintendo. Why not? Intel is out to kill AMD. AMD is out to kill Intel. Sony is out to kill Xbox. Nintendo is out to kill the Playstation... etc.... etc... don't buy the PR from any company. They're all in to win. And there's nothing wrong with that. At the end of the day, the consumer wins from the battles. We've gotten both innovation and subsidized hardware as a result. Do you think we'd be better off if MS hadn't taken on Sony? There would have been no drive for them to cut the PS3 price without the 360's success, since the two machines are competing for a similar demographic. And thus far it's pretty arguable that MS has delivered the better games this generation than either of its competitors.

So why should I, as a professional and as a consumer, hate MS? Or, for that matter, any company that is out there simply to compete in the market?

#28 BeOS was a pleasure to use and develop for. I loved that OS.

#29 Chris, you should make that into a rts game.

Create a HQ, spawn coders, artists, scripters.

Nintendo vs Microsoft vs Sony vs The Indies (no way just GG could take on Darth Gates)

You'd have to gather mountain dew for your coders to work and pacifiers for your artists, etc.

A game about making games! I hope I get to see my name in the credits.