Game Development Community

Programming-Oriented Questions

by Ronnie · in Technical Issues · 10/28/2007 (11:02 am) · 3 replies

Hello evreyone,

Here are some programming-oriented questions
for expereinced TGE / TGEA users.

I am looking to purchase one of them:

(A) Edition Differences

Could anyone please refer me to some
comparison table where the major
difference(s) between the two are
spelled out? I have read on their respective
pages that TGEA makes games more realistic,
and has some better handling of various
engine function(s) programmatically/otherwise,
but is there more?


(B) Other Issues


1. Content Packs

1.1. Would any of them come with source code?
1.2. Would any of them be compatible with either
edition, TGE or TGEA? And if so, how would I,
programmatically-speaking, "convince" the
main application (TGE / TGEA) to work with them?
1.3. Would TGE/TGEA be able of importing 3D
models from a third-party model-making software?
1.4. Would importing of 3D models and/or "worlds" be available
only during game design, or also in real-time, during a game?


2. Character Animation : in-game commands / script / otherwise

2.1. Would characters be motion-capable, so that,
for example, I could have a person walking?
2.2. Could characters express emotions on their faces?
2.3. Could a character's facial expressions be dynamic,
or in other words, change from one emotion
to a different one?


3. User's Game Settings

3.1. I've read that the scripting language allows for
file I/O. Does that mean that the user can save/load
game settings only - or a full scene?
3.2. If a game scene is loaded - can TGE/TGEA rebuild
the whole "world" of that game, plus its characters,
plus everything else included? (I'm not sure how that works).


4. Music

4.1. Can games include music?
4.2. Can games include sound effects,
to occur on specific events, say,
when a characters sees an object?
4.3. What sound-file formats are supported?
For example, MIDI, WAV, MP3, etc.?


5. TorqueNet

5.1. Does TorqueNet make Internet-capable games
possible? (That's my understanding, anyway).
5.2. Do I need to have my own website + a dedicated
game server, or can I keep just a portion of the site
available for gamers, without interfering with
regular visitors?
5.3. How am I to find out about all of the bandwidth, capacity,
and other administration settings, that may be required
for a game server? (This subject is rather new to me).


6. What's Included - Online Help (to be downloadable)

6.1. Demo games?
6.2. Code examples?
6.3. Source-Code Documentation?
6.4. User's Guide?


OK,
Thanks much in advance,
Ronnie
:-)

#1
10/28/2007 (11:36 am)
I'll do what I can.

1. If you are looking to do a 3d game, TGE (Torque Game Engine) or TGEA (Torque Game Engine Advanced) are your best bets. TGE is easier to get used to, so if you are new to programming and/or game programming, it would be your best bet. TGEA has a completely rewritten terrain engine and render pipeline. This allows for next generation graphics capabilities and shaders. (Note, you could always implement the Modernization Kit into TGE to get some shader capabilities into TGE, but it will not be as powerful as TGEA).

TGE is also cross-platform, where TGEA is windows(direct-x) only.


1.1 Most (if not all) come with the source code, as well as the un-exported 3d files so you can import them into your 3d editor for modification or re-export as well as scripts to get them working right away, as well as to show you how to use them. This can be great for learning different features, like how the Hoverbike pack shows you how to take a 4 wheeled vehicle and make it feel like a 2.
1.2 You will most likely have to reexport them to a DTS to get them to work with TGEA, but all-in-all they should be compatible with both.
1.3 They are both compatible with the DTS format only. You can find exporters for many of the more popular graphics applications. If your application of choice isn't supported you could also export to a shared format and import into Blender for example and export from there.
1.4 Loading new 'worlds' during runtime isn't supported out of the box, but you do get the source-code so anything is possible. Adding new objects is definitely supported during runtime.

2.1 Characters can be rigged and animated, including blended animations. You should get the demos to see this in action.
2.2 There are resources available for people with licenses that would make this possible.
2.3 You do have the source code, so you can do anything you want.

3.1 Full scenes (missions) are actually saved to their own file .mis, these can be loaded to allow different levels or missions.
3.2 I don't know what you mean here, it doesn't need to be rebuilt...

4.1 Yes.
4.2 Yes.
4.3 Out of the box I believe its wav, mp3, and ogg. Though other formats could be added with source code edits.

5.1 Yes it does, the torque network library is an award winning networking solution.
5.2 A website is not needed at all, nor is a dedicated servers. Users can host their own games. It would be more secure if you hosted your own server though.
5.3 You may want to start a thread for this question... as well as even just run your own stress tests.

6.1 You get 2 'starter' packs, Starter.FPS and Starter.Racing
6.2 Lots and lots and lots of resources available on the web.
6.3 The code is documented in places, but it isn't everywhere.
6.4 There are docs out there, including TDN which has a few tuts and examples and helpful hints.


Firstly, I'd really recommend you get the demos for TGE and TGEA, they are a quick download and would have answered over half of these questions for you!
#2
10/28/2007 (11:38 am)
Here's my answers, I may be wrong on some things because I'm still learning about all the areas of torque, most of this I'm sure of however.

A) Edition Differences

Quote:Could anyone please refer me to some
comparison table where the major
difference(s) between the two are
spelled out? I have read on their respective
pages that TGEA makes games more realistic,
and has some better handling of various
engine function(s) programmatically/otherwise,
but is there more?

Comparison
Mainly in TGEA you're going to find a huge graphical difference. There are some different engine functions, but most of them pertain to visual and sound effects. With both you can create incredible games, and modify the source code (with a liscence) to fit any need, programming-wise both are similar. But TGEA has much better graphics quality, which will not only make the game look nicer but help if you rely on any visual effects (like lighting for a horror game.)


(B) Other Issues


1. Content Packs

Quote:1.1. Would any of them come with source code?
Most do, it should say in the description. Most model packs come with not only .dts(the model format for torque) but other formats such as maya, lightwave, etc...

Quote:1.2. Would any of them be compatible with either
edition, TGE or TGEA? And if so, how would I,
programmatically-speaking, "convince" the
main application (TGE / TGEA) to work with them?[/qoute]
You would just add it to the code, I don't think I can explain this very well.

[quote[1.3. Would TGE/TGEA be able of importing 3D
models from a third-party model-making software?
Of course, it'ssort the only way. Though there is constructor for editing interior/.dif models, to make an item or object, you need to make it in another program and then export it to a .dts format. You could always write an exporter for your own 3d software but programs that support it, or with a simple download can, include Lightwave, Maya, 3ds, Milkshape, Blender, and many others.

Quote:1.4. Would importing of 3D models and/or "worlds" be available
only during game design, or also in real-time, during a game?[/qoute]
You can load in a model which already has it's data in the engine and has been executed at startup (very simple to do, 1 line of code) but in TGE to load a completely new mission file (world) you need to completely load it. With Atlas and paging terrain in TGEA as long as it was built beforehand in the mission, you can run right up to it, teleport there, anything. And have worlds hundreds of miles across without tiling.


2. Character Animation : in-game commands / script / otherwise

[quote]2.1. Would characters be motion-capable, so that,
for example, I could have a person walking?[/qoute]
Of course.

[quote]2.2. Could characters express emotions on their faces?
This I'm not too sure about, I've never really tried.
Quote:2.3. Could a character's facial expressions be dynamic,
or in other words, change from one emotion to a different one?
Same as above.


3. User's Game Settings

Quote:3.1. I've read that the scripting language allows for
file I/O. Does that mean that the user can save/load
game settings only - or a full scene?
I've seen example of people saving entire missions, and resources with it so it must be possible, even with a little editing.


4. Music

Quote:4.1. Can games include music?
Of course. From background music to ambient sounds.
Quote:4.2. Can games include sound effects,
to occur on specific events, say,
when a characters sees an object?
You can have sound effects for anything from a certain objects use (picking up an item or shooting a gun for example) to entering an area to character speech (I'm not sure about syncing lips though, never tried.) To set up sound when a character sees an object you could either set a trigger that plays the sound when they enter, and set the trigger in front of the object or other things.
Quote:4.3. What sound-file formats are supported?
For example, MIDI, WAV, MP3, etc.?
I know it supports ogg and wav. Others I don't know.


5. TorqueNet

Quote:5.1. Does TorqueNet make Internet-capable games
possible? (That's my understanding, anyway).
Yes, up to...64 players I think. You could mod it however to make an MMO. Search for "Minions of Mirth" it is an MMO made with torque, and many packs are being worked on to support MMO use.

Quote:5.2. Do I need to have my own website + a dedicated
game server, or can I keep just a portion of the site
available for gamers, without interfering with
regular visitors?
Do you mean using GarageGames.com for your game site? No you would need your own.

Quote:5.3. How am I to find out about all of the bandwidth, capacity,
and other administration settings, that may be required
for a game server? (This subject is rather new to me).
This is pretty new to me too, sorry.


6. What's Included - Online Help (to be downloadable)

Quote:6.1. Demo games?
TGE comes with an fps starter kit, and a racing starter kit these both give example of torque games.

Quote:6.2. Code examples?
In the demo kits all the code is included to be viewed or modified.

Quote:6.3. Source-Code Documentation?
6.4. User's Guide?
TDN, Torque Developer Network, a link to it is under the Documentation tab. It's like torque-wiki. You log in there with your garagegames username and password and can find info on every engine/console function in torque, tutorials and more. You do not know how much TDN has helped me.


Well, I hope that helped you out. If not at least I got the comparison page link XD. But Torque is a great engine for games, and really cheap too. If you have the money I would suggest TGEA over TGE just for the graphics. It will make your games look 100 times better with all the effects as long as you have good artists who can keep up with it. Download the demo of TGE and TGEA to check it out before you buy though.
#3
10/29/2007 (5:36 am)
Hello again,

I would like to thank you both,
Shawn Simas and Morrock,
for your valuable insight(s).

Good day,
Ronnie
:-)