Torque needs to be more user friendly

#1

Quote:
not everyoned has a text editor,

What do you think you are viewing the .cs files with? a paint program?

If someone goes in and starts editing the script files in their game they get what they deserve if it quits working.

There are separate default files so that you can keep the orginal controls. Why would you save keybinds (a clientside thing) in a file called server.txt?

The average Joe and Jane do not need to be messing around with the files in their game dir.

-Tim aka Spock

#2 First off, every jane/joe does have a text editor. For the sake of argument, let's say you're on the most common platform, Windows. Ever hear of notepad?

Second, there should be no need to edit the config scripts directly. It should all be handled through the game's interface. The syntax of the scripting language (be it Q3A or Torque) is irrelevant to jane/joe user. And yes, Q3A keeps defaults, too.

And finally, this is a developer forum. People are developer-minded because they are developers and do know the difference between a float and a literal.

#3 Im not sure I understand what you are saying. You can open .cs files in wordpad too.

Maybe I wasn't clear before when I posted.

d00d, evry 1 h4s a t3Xt3d|t0r. 3v3N 0n \/\/|nd0z3. Can you understand me better now?

You as a developer should make it where the person does not have to edit any configuration files. The worst case should be editing stuff through the console.

Just curious how old are you?

I'm not trying to flame you or anything but your post was very tough to read in the English language and you didn't seem to get that everyone has a text editor on their computer. That is what wordpad, MS Word, notepad, OpenOffice writer, Abiword, emacs, vi, nano, Microsoft Works, Lotus, and anything else that has the ability to edit text. At least 2 of these are in windows standard and most windows users have at least 3 of these.

To my knowledge every joe and jane should know what a text editor actually is, they may not know that a .cs file is a text file with the .cs extension instead of a .txt extension but if they even attempt to open it then windows will probably direct them to notepad.

Like I said before the average joe or jane should not be messing with the game's config files and expect to actually do something besides screwing up your game.

I'm sorry if you think Im just personally attacking you but you should think more about what you post before you do and at least proof read it. I am serious about the age thing...Im really curious.

-Tim aka Spock

#4 *sigh* Watch this turn into 50 posts of wasted effort...

Things are fine really...

-J

#5 I don't really mean to flame anyone....I won't continue anymore with it so dont worry Joshua. I did have difficulty in reading his posts and the fact that it didn't seem like he knew what a text editor was or anything about file extensions vs the data in the actual file. The second one may have came from the first though. I am not the that great at spelling and my english sucks at times but I try to at least make it readable by all. All this crap was talked about in a previous post so there is no need to bring it all up again.

-Tim aka Spock

#6 Ace,

I don't quite understand what you are asking for. A text editor? For what? From what I could gather in your post (it's a little hard to read), you switched video cards and there was a problem?

Since you have all the source code to the engine, maybe you can implement your idea for a way to make the Torque easier for end unders. I'm not quite following your issue.

Jeff Tunnell GG

#7 No I am not ask for any thing, sorry if I am the only one who thinks the default torque directories is more complex then it needs to be for the end user. This was just supposed to be a simple comment on the default torque directories and what the new guy/gal sees if they get an idea to mod there own game. (It will be very confusing and may change there mind (just my opinion) didn't mean to tick anyone off.

When the change from v12 to torque happened I was really confused, and although now I understand how it all works, I just think it is a little too much and needs to be toned down a bit. Sure I could do it just for my project but then it wouldn't be a standard torque directory type setup.

Ok so it could be just me, I don't know how to explain it any better .

#8 Here is the directory structure my end users (currently the BETA testers) see right now with BETA 1.32:

Directory of C:\atwtest

.              <DIR>        06-11-02  9:43p .
..             <DIR>        06-11-02  9:43p ..
USER     COG       281,540  06-11-02  9:54p user.cog
TW       EXE     2,904,064  06-11-02  7:52p tw.exe
README   TXT         3,823  05-21-02 10:09p README.TXT
MAIN     CS            486  06-11-02  8:41p main.cs
GLU2D3D  DLL        57,344  01-20-02 10:26a glu2d3d.dll
OPENGL~1 DLL       204,800  01-20-02 10:26a opengl2d3d.dll
FPS      COG    32,784,479  06-11-02  9:53p fps.cog
COMMON   COG       136,428  06-11-02  9:53p common.cog
         8 file(s)     36,372,964 bytes
         2 dir(s)        6,480.09 MB free

Notice that there are NO sub-directories, and no prefs files ... what could be simpler ?

#9 Ya, ken, agreed, that is plain simple, looks like i will have to start thinking more of NoESCape (me) rather then Torque (the comunity) i dont know somthing will have to be done :)

#10 .txt? .cs? what's the difference? both are text files... i don't see what's ur problem... extensions aren't needed for things to work, they are just a shortcut to identify the type of a file... in *nix there are no extensions (at least in std nix)
Why? cause extensions aint part of the file data, just a fancy 3 letter name invented in the dos decades for the FAT system to identify the file types better, like dos would check if file myfile had a .exe extension then it'll attempt to execute the file, or if it had a .bat extension then it would attemp to parse it.. etc...
so... .txt? .cs? i dont see where's ur problem?

Also, as tim said, no normal user should edit files by himself, that's what the options dialog is for...
Also i dont see why changing from tnt2 to gf3 would make ur screen go weirdo.. that shouldn't happen, maybe some other problem...
Instead of just complaining of a TGE problem, realize it mostly might be ur fault and investigate it a bit.
Also, if one of ur joe/janes wants to make a mod then they wont get scared, if they are coders they are supposed to be used to figuring complex stuff, if they can't then it's better that they give up cause of ur dir structure, cause it would be wasted effort.

Good Luck with solving ur vid card problem
Regards,
eXoDuS

#11 ya i tred to open up a .cs on my kids computer with note pad and thats what set me off , i dint think of using wordpad (a brain fart i guess)

i still dont know why the geforce3 dont like torque on her computer , i have formated c: ,and reinstall the drivers with no luck ,, heh funny thing is q3 runs great (and is why i thought somthing in torque may be the culprit???

#12 I had a problem with on my GF3 with textures on the interiors. Once I entered through a portal it'd go all psychadelic until I faced a doorway. If there was no doorway (deeper inside the interior), it'd stay that way. I updated to the latest nvidia reference drivers and the problem was fixed. Don't know what OS you're on but here's a link to the 9X ones: www.nvidia.com/view.asp?PAGE=windows9x

#13 thanks for the link,it worth a shot i guess, now that you mention it ,i remeber up gradinf a tnt2 with reator critical nvidia drver's to clear up streching texture issue

#14

Quote:ya i tred to open up a .cs on my kids computer with note pad and thats what set me off , i dint think of using wordpad (a brain fart i guess)

Sounds like user error. Notepad will open .cs files, .gui, .mis, and some other extensions torque uses...in fact I edit them in it. Its all text and notepad is a text editor. If your trying to open the .cs.dso file (if you have file extensions hidden it would look like a .cs file) then you are trying to open compiled script in a text editor and you can't do that because the .cs.dso files are not meant to be edited. Just like you can't open a .exe in a text editor and expect to edit the source code.

-Spock

#15 hmm yup your kinda right again, but when you open the config.cs it looks like this
www.planetquake.com/noescape/dev2/notepad.jpg

well the point is mute anyways ( now you see where im coming from)

#16 But this (opening scripts in notepad) is a Windows/user problem, not a Torque problem.

#17 That file looks that way in Notepad because it has the wrong CR-LF formatting. Open it in Wordpad and it will look fine.