Tribes2 and torque
by Robert Dunne · in Technical Issues · 06/05/2002 (5:01 pm) · 15 replies
I have lots of games for linux. (RTCW, almost all loki titles, independents, etc) And the only game that crashes on me is Tribes2. It used to work fine, except for the forums, but now it freezes whenever it loads a new mission. (I have to switch consoles and kill it) I don't know why it stopped working, i thought it might be either because I updated the kernel or glibc.
My question is, will there be a patch for linux, and if not, is it possible to compile torque and use my tribes2 data files? Is there a certain glibc, or kernel that works best?
Help! I love tribes2, and rebooting to windows is not an option, because then I lose my server.
I would pay the $100 license fee just to play Tribes2. (Yes I'm sick, and no I'm not rich)
My question is, will there be a patch for linux, and if not, is it possible to compile torque and use my tribes2 data files? Is there a certain glibc, or kernel that works best?
Help! I love tribes2, and rebooting to windows is not an option, because then I lose my server.
I would pay the $100 license fee just to play Tribes2. (Yes I'm sick, and no I'm not rich)
#2
Jeff Tunnell GG
06/05/2002 (5:21 pm)
You cannot create Tribes 2 from the Torque. We are not upgrading the Linux code. Our contract with Sierra is for the WIN version only. Sorry.Jeff Tunnell GG
#3
06/05/2002 (6:20 pm)
Of course, Jeff means "...not upgrading the Tribes 2 Linux code.". I know everyone realizes that. Just want to make sure :-)
#5
I don't blame GG for this since they are simply fulfilling their contract, but I think it's extremely low of Sierra to update the windows port only. So, and I know most of you won't care, but Sierra can know kiss my ass (excuse the rude language), since I will no longer purchase a game from them. This includes any games made by a subsidary of Vivendi Entertainment. I guess this settle whether I should purchase Warcraft 3.
Screw them. I paid just as much for my copy of Tribes 2 as any other windows user. And yes, Loki going out of business is partly to blame, but Sierra should not have supported this dual-release if they didn't intend to support until the end.
Yes, I'm a little bit upset. Yet that is the way of the Linux gamer. We're going to get screwed for a long while until our market grows. This is why I will keep supporting companies who support Linux. This is why I will purchase NWN. I don't care for that genre of game, but Bioware is kind enough and thoughtful to put out a Linux version, so they will get my money. Hell, If Sierra releases another game for Linux, I will go back on my promise to boycott them. However that is unlikely in the near futurem so again, screw them.
I should probably mention a side note that I really admire and appreciate GG's efforts to keep the Torque engine mutli-platform. I also appreciate all the work done by associates for the Linux version. This specifically includes John and Tim.
I'm sorry for the rant, but this upset me. I've been hoping that Sierra would have the decency to keep supporting us. It would have made them look so amazing to the community. Instead they are just like any other company. Bah.
--Edit
Just one question for Jeff. You guys aren't even doing the server port? Just the windows client and server? Right? Man I'm upset.
06/05/2002 (11:01 pm)
Wow, This is your first official reply on the Linux update (or lack there of). Well I guess I won't be upgrading my 2 Linux tribes 2 server. I don't believe that I should serve the windows community while forcing myself from being unable to play the Linux version.I don't blame GG for this since they are simply fulfilling their contract, but I think it's extremely low of Sierra to update the windows port only. So, and I know most of you won't care, but Sierra can know kiss my ass (excuse the rude language), since I will no longer purchase a game from them. This includes any games made by a subsidary of Vivendi Entertainment. I guess this settle whether I should purchase Warcraft 3.
Screw them. I paid just as much for my copy of Tribes 2 as any other windows user. And yes, Loki going out of business is partly to blame, but Sierra should not have supported this dual-release if they didn't intend to support until the end.
Yes, I'm a little bit upset. Yet that is the way of the Linux gamer. We're going to get screwed for a long while until our market grows. This is why I will keep supporting companies who support Linux. This is why I will purchase NWN. I don't care for that genre of game, but Bioware is kind enough and thoughtful to put out a Linux version, so they will get my money. Hell, If Sierra releases another game for Linux, I will go back on my promise to boycott them. However that is unlikely in the near futurem so again, screw them.
I should probably mention a side note that I really admire and appreciate GG's efforts to keep the Torque engine mutli-platform. I also appreciate all the work done by associates for the Linux version. This specifically includes John and Tim.
I'm sorry for the rant, but this upset me. I've been hoping that Sierra would have the decency to keep supporting us. It would have made them look so amazing to the community. Instead they are just like any other company. Bah.
--Edit
Just one question for Jeff. You guys aren't even doing the server port? Just the windows client and server? Right? Man I'm upset.
#6
Our official position is this:
GarageGames supports Linux in the Torque, for both the client and server. We use open source tools at GG and fully support non-monopolistic operating systems. We cannot and will not speak to Sierra's support of Linux for Tribes 2 in the coming update.
Jeff Tunnell GG
06/06/2002 (7:58 am)
If you want to know about Sierra's take on the Linux version of the Tribes 2 update, talk to them. I have absolutely no comment on the Linux client or server. Please do not keep putting us in the position of speaking for Linux regarding this project.Our official position is this:
GarageGames supports Linux in the Torque, for both the client and server. We use open source tools at GG and fully support non-monopolistic operating systems. We cannot and will not speak to Sierra's support of Linux for Tribes 2 in the coming update.
Jeff Tunnell GG
#7
Jeff Tunnell GG
06/06/2002 (8:02 am)
Here is Alex's latest post on TribalWar regarding Linux for the Tribes 2 update:Quote:
The issue of Linux support is still looming and is currently still unresolved. Sierra cannot support Linux code, but we are open to a reputable Linux development company picking up where Loki left off. None have offered to date.
Jeff Tunnell GG
#8
I understand how annoying it must be for Linux gamers, but we have to ask ourselves whether we want to support linux as a gaming platoform or the PC as a gaming platform. We need to stay competetive if we are going to keep up with consoles, and trying to get everyone who writes a game for the PC to write two different versions is not a way of doing that.
In other words: take one for the team.
06/06/2002 (8:03 am)
Re: the above rant.I understand how annoying it must be for Linux gamers, but we have to ask ourselves whether we want to support linux as a gaming platoform or the PC as a gaming platform. We need to stay competetive if we are going to keep up with consoles, and trying to get everyone who writes a game for the PC to write two different versions is not a way of doing that.
In other words: take one for the team.
#9
--KallDrexx
06/06/2002 (9:01 am)
well wine and wineX are evolving very nicely, and even though some games don't work many new games DO work (latest version of wine, i can play jk2 in linux perfectly!). However all software i'm writing will be in 2 different versions (*nix/OSX and win32 code) as I use mostly platform independant code. Of course, this may not be an option for some companies... *shrug*. --KallDrexx
#10
Anyways, you are right. I will address my concerns about the Linux port to Sierra once more. Also, I don't believe I've ever blamed GG for any lack of support for Linux. I understand (now) that Sierra specifically contracted you guys for the windows patch. And as I mentioned somewhere in that rant, I really respect GG for the amount of support you guys have provided for alternative OSes to Windows for the Torque engine. I have noticed that you guys have specifically gone out of your way to use free and open software. So once again, I have no issues with GG. The only reason I asked that last question was because you guys would seem to know better than anyone else what you were contracted for.
Ian,
I almost started arguing with you, but I realize you are right in a sense. I'm not sure if I understand what you mean by taking one for the team. Does that mean I should just give up on Linux gaming? Ian, I don't like windows much, but I don't hate it. I don't care if windows stays around or disappears. I don't think the goal of Linux should be of destroying windows. I just think it's nice to have an alternative. And I don't think people need to write two different versions of the same game to get them working on two separate OSes. I think if the engine is designed properly, it can easily be supported on multiple platforms. A few examples are the Torque engine, the Quake Engine(s), and the NWN game. I think if it can be done easily, it really doesn't hurt the game developer to support multiple platforms.
Having said all this, I should add that the Linux gaming market is still in it's infancy and is probably not very profitable, but it is growing. I don't think we should give up, nor do I think we are fighting a losing battle. I'm not giving up just yet.
06/06/2002 (9:09 am)
Jeff, I apologize. I did not mean to put the GG staff in this situation. I wrote that last night late, and right after I had found out about the status of the Linux port. In all fairness, this is the first time that GG has commented on whether they were handling the Linux port or not, even though the question has been asked many times. Personally, I spent quite a bit of time trying to figure out if the patch was just for windows or for both platforms, since it was never explicitely stated.Anyways, you are right. I will address my concerns about the Linux port to Sierra once more. Also, I don't believe I've ever blamed GG for any lack of support for Linux. I understand (now) that Sierra specifically contracted you guys for the windows patch. And as I mentioned somewhere in that rant, I really respect GG for the amount of support you guys have provided for alternative OSes to Windows for the Torque engine. I have noticed that you guys have specifically gone out of your way to use free and open software. So once again, I have no issues with GG. The only reason I asked that last question was because you guys would seem to know better than anyone else what you were contracted for.
Ian,
I almost started arguing with you, but I realize you are right in a sense. I'm not sure if I understand what you mean by taking one for the team. Does that mean I should just give up on Linux gaming? Ian, I don't like windows much, but I don't hate it. I don't care if windows stays around or disappears. I don't think the goal of Linux should be of destroying windows. I just think it's nice to have an alternative. And I don't think people need to write two different versions of the same game to get them working on two separate OSes. I think if the engine is designed properly, it can easily be supported on multiple platforms. A few examples are the Torque engine, the Quake Engine(s), and the NWN game. I think if it can be done easily, it really doesn't hurt the game developer to support multiple platforms.
Having said all this, I should add that the Linux gaming market is still in it's infancy and is probably not very profitable, but it is growing. I don't think we should give up, nor do I think we are fighting a losing battle. I'm not giving up just yet.
#11
Even though the Torque supports Linux, I cannot imagine a commercial game ever really making money selling on that platform. Look at how our announcement was received on Slashdot. That is a tough audience that expects perfection, and mostly expects it for free.
The next problem is that there really is not a Linux operating system. There is Suse, Mandrake, Red Hat, etc. They are not the same, so support is an absolute nightmare.
We will continue to support Linux for Torque because we believe in the process, and want choice as well. Linux gets better all the time, and some day it will overcome the obstacles and be a viable alternative. I do think it will make it to the desktop, but I think it will be years before it makes economic sense to make games for the platform.
BTW, we did not say anything about the Linux port of the Tribes 2 update because we are under non-disclosure. I think it was obvious from what we did not say that the Linux port was not on our plates.
Jeff Tunnell GG
06/06/2002 (9:40 am)
Linux support cannot be done easily. Nothing in this business is easy, but especailly Linux support.Even though the Torque supports Linux, I cannot imagine a commercial game ever really making money selling on that platform. Look at how our announcement was received on Slashdot. That is a tough audience that expects perfection, and mostly expects it for free.
The next problem is that there really is not a Linux operating system. There is Suse, Mandrake, Red Hat, etc. They are not the same, so support is an absolute nightmare.
We will continue to support Linux for Torque because we believe in the process, and want choice as well. Linux gets better all the time, and some day it will overcome the obstacles and be a viable alternative. I do think it will make it to the desktop, but I think it will be years before it makes economic sense to make games for the platform.
BTW, we did not say anything about the Linux port of the Tribes 2 update because we are under non-disclosure. I think it was obvious from what we did not say that the Linux port was not on our plates.
Jeff Tunnell GG
#13
06/06/2002 (7:21 pm)
Bugging Sierra to support Linux Tribes 2 is better than nothing but I very much doubt they will do it themselves. As pointed out in the post above, they are looking for a "reputable linux company" to support the game. To me, that means Transgaming. So the Linux Tribes 2 community should petition them as well. It will be easy for Transgaming to do this patch, and it will be good publicity and more subscriptions as well.
#14
06/19/2002 (6:28 pm)
Jeff, I have owned a lot of linux OS'es and its not as bad as you think. I am NOT saying it is easy, nor am I saying its difficult. I see the position you're in, but maybe, if Sierra agree's, maybe a private group of people could take up they burden. Look where communities have got linux. One great example is Debian.
#15
I wrote my win32 AND X windows kernel for my 3d engine in about less than a day. Handles events and keystrokes, later i'll add in multi-threading. And I had just learned that code that day (the X code that is, i knew the win32 code). It doesn't seem that hard at all.. but hta'ts just me. *shrugs again*
--Kalldrexx
06/19/2002 (8:12 pm)
*shrugs*I wrote my win32 AND X windows kernel for my 3d engine in about less than a day. Handles events and keystrokes, later i'll add in multi-threading. And I had just learned that code that day (the X code that is, i knew the win32 code). It doesn't seem that hard at all.. but hta'ts just me. *shrugs again*
--Kalldrexx
Torque Owner Aaron Davenport
--Aaron