Open source game? (Noob question)

#1 You can make a Open TorqueScript Source game, as long as the actual source of the engine never gets compromised.

However, making it GNU GPL is not possible. Torque ain't GPL to begin with.

Edit: It does not matter if you buy the engine or not, you can't switch license because you're not the owner.

#2 I don't know about the GNU GPL, but it's certainly fine to distribute a game you make with the compiled binary and all the script uncompiled and open.

#3

Quote:I don't know about the GNU GPL, but it's certainly fine to distribute a game you make with the compiled binary and all the script uncompiled and open.

I'm fine about not being GPL, it's just that I DO NOT own the TGE source. I wanted to do this game entirely in tourquescript, and wanted to know if I could distribute a game made with the DEMO of TGE.

IF I did want to make an open tourquescript game and distribute it under the GPL, would I have to buy TGE? (Tourquescript only, not full C++ source.)

#4 You don't have to buy TGE to make an open torquescript game and distribute it.
However, as I said in my previous post, you cannot make it GPL.

Why do you need it to be GPL? You can distribute TorqueScript code as much as you want.

#5 Huh. I didn't know that, I'd always thought you had to own a license to TGE to distribute your game to anyone else.

#6 As long as you don't sell it, I don't think they care. I mean, the demo is out there avaliable to anyone.

#7 Reading clause iii above it looks to me like you cannot distribute the demo with altered files; that seems like it would preclude distributing your mod without a TGE license.

#8 Hi.

The EULA seems clear regarding your question.
Clause ii says that you can create derivative works only for your personal use, so you can't give it to others.
In the last line it says that you need to own a license to distribute a modified version, so I think that you can't do what you ask.

Bye,
Jacopo

#9 Odd, I was pretty sure you could distribute the demo with modified scripts as long as you didnt make any money out of it. Perhaps the clause is old and havent been updated?

#10 I think ny modified it means, modified in the engine code, though that would be kinda redundant....

#11 I'd be inclined to think, though, that distributing the scripts and content files WITHOUT distributing the engine itself, and including a link to here that says "Go Download This" would probably satisfy.

Of course, I could be wrong...

#12 ^ So based on Cliff's suggestion...

1) Is it okay to distribute your personal TorqueScripts freely?
2) Distribute your personal mod package and assets as if it were a patch to the demo?

Example: Download Torque Demo and install, then from let's say my website, download and install myModPatch.exe that'll copy and overwrite files in the Torque demo.

Anything illegal with that?

#13 I dont see how they can stop you from doing distributing it as source, separate from and containing none of Garagegames's assets.

#14 Uh. If none of GarageGame's source is in there, then what's the point with this discussion Dylan? It wouldn't be Torque anyway. Unless you're talking about script.

#15 Stefan, I think he's saying that it's legal for me to distribute an executable that contains only the tourquescript/art/whatever else, so long as it doesn't contain anything owned by garagegames (IE: tge.exe, ORIGINAL character files, TGE example code.)
I guess that sounds like a good Idea, telling people to go out and get the TGE demo, then download MY .exe/tarball/.zip, copy them into their own directory, then extract the tge.exe, opengl2d3d.dll (Which they so kindly distributed in their package, saving me some bandwith.), and openal.dll, pasting them into the directory, therefore making the game usable. Then, I would be able to distribute the mod package under the GNU GPL.
And thanks to clause iii, I can mirror the demo on my own servers, therefore ensuring that, with the release of TGE 1.5, people wishing to use my mod will be able to, on the off chance that the EULA changes between 1.4 and 1.5.

Thanks!
-E/C

#16 Okay common guys it's $100 ... I think we have wasted more then that in time discussing this :) .... just my humble oppinion.

#17 ElementC

Funny. Did you not understand that you cannot release something under GNU GPL which is already under another license or do you simply not care? Just because TorqueScript is considered free does not mean that you own the software or that it has no license already. If it has and you're not the owner of the property, then you cannot change it.

1. This applies to any software.

2. You could possibly release the scripts under GPL ( because you made them ).

3. You can release the whole mod package for free, but it still applies under TGE's license.

Practically there's no difference, but it seems like you want GPL just for the heck of it.

-

#18 Just my opinion:
The demo is for evaluating purpose. That means that everyone can download and try it, to decide if Torque suits him. If it does, then he should just buy it.
It seems to me that you are trying to find a way to use Torque without paying for it. That's not fair.

If you think that Torque is a good product, then you should pay it. If you think it's not, or it's not worth 100$ (!), then you should look for one of the free tools over the net (Ogre, for example).

BTW, clause ii in the EULA clearly says that you can create derivative works with the demo, ONLY for your personal use. I think that this excludes the distribution to other people.

Bye,
Jacopo

P.S. I think Torque is a steal for that price. I know that 100$ could be a lot of money for someone, but it's a very good price for what you get. If you like it, please consider buying it.

And no, I don't get any money if you decide to buy! ;-)

#19 I'm quite sure you couldn't release the scripts under the GPL, as it has pretty stringent requirements for dual or multiple licensing schemes, and I'm quite sure the TGE license doesn't fit the bill, to leave it at that...
Which you could have found out by doing a bit of research on the GPL, but no matter.
Your TGE game will never be open source, as even with a license you can't release the source to the executable, so why this focus on the GPL ? There are other alternatives to shipping a TGE (not TGB) with its scripts in text form, going from you granting a right of use for modding the game to your scripts, to public domain (if possible at all, you'll notice the GG owned TGE scripts are available but still their own IP), with many possible open source licenses available in between, excluding the GPL imho, but including BSD, zlib, MIT, etc.
What is sure, is you can't change the license to the scripts included in TGE, whether you ship them in text or binary form : you don't own that IP, even if you license the engine.
Which is the main reason why you can't use the GPL at all with TGE products, whether you've licensed the engine or not, the game is free or sold : the GPL is not compatible with proprietary licenses if any of what you plan to GPL is dependent on IP under the proprietary license, which would be the case for any TGE scripts.
I'm not a lawyer, I might be wrong in the details, but overall, I think this is the picture

#20 Thanks, Nicolas. I guess I'll just go with Irrlicht engine. I'm not trying to make a game for free, I just don't want my volunteer team (10+ people) to have to pay a hundred bucks each. It's just not nice. If I have to go with an open-source engine, I will. And yes, If I had have decided to go forward with an open-tourqescript project, I would have purchased an indie license. However, if this game does turn out well, I might stick with the open-source side of things.

On the off chance that I would purchase a TGE license, would I be able to make an open-tourquescript game?

Just so you all know WHY I MUST have an open-tourquescript game, the world it takes place in is very big. And getting bigger by the minute. It is so huge that if I were to try, with my all volunteer team (Yay!), to create the world this takes place in, the known size of the world would have doubled . However, if I make it so the players can expand their world (Not just in locations, either: a conpletely new system for weapons comes about every year. However, the story dictates that "legacy" weapons remain in use.), that takes a HUGE load off of my team.

I'm not sure if you guys do this in this forum system, but you may close this topic whenever you feel like it!

Cheers!
-E/C
(P. S.: I have no problem with torque's license. Matter of fact, I really doubt my need of GPL. I just like the spirit of it.)