I don't understand how Torque works

#1 You can do anything you want with TGE, but you have know how to code and use the source code. TGE isn't just a run time you throw your pretty graphics and sounds into and click the button for a game to run. It's a programmers game engine. hopefully that helps

#2 Adam,

I don't have any experience with 3DGS, but I'm loving TGE and TSE. Yes, TG/SE are aimed at first/thrid person shooters, but you can do other things as well. Using existing Torque physics, you could certainly make a 'wacky' styled 3D bowling game using script alone. However, if you want realistic physics, you will need to get into the source code and tinker with it. It would be difficult for the Garage Games guys to create an engine that meets every possible and potential game-type. It's best if you think of Torque as a platform that handles many common game tasks. It's up to you to make it into something unique and special.

There will never be a magic bullet. The bottom line is this -- anything that's worth creating requires a lot of effort to make. In my opinion, that's the way it should be.

:)

Aaron E.

#3 The expansion packs such as the RTS one you mentioned merely add useful functionality, which you could very well add yourself: there's nothing stopping you making an RTS with a basic TGE build.

#4 The major reason is the massive amount of game-specific logic and coding necessary to make different gametypes and optimize them. A number of engines such as Unity, BeyondVirtual, and 3DGS help you along the path by abstracting your gametypes to easily let you prototype everything. Unfortunately, fine-tuning in these engines is sometimes quite a task so you may get up to speed with a single gametype quickly but end up putting a large amount of time into optimization later. Then there are game API's which allow you a strong starting point by giving you the tools but you have to create the code from the ground up for your game. Torque is somewhere in the middle. It provides a lot of great tools but also gives you the source to help facilitate anything you want to make. But it is neither as easy to get into and learn as some engines or as complicated as building up your engine from scratch with game API's.

You can actually make some very good games (which you will have to optimize greatly and often have to work with resources) using only TorqueScript. The RTS kit is a code collection of abstracted pieces of RTS gaming. It is quite a bit more than simply adding a camera transform and some click-n-pick code. There's nothing stopping you from making a RTS. In fact, there's a guy whose been working on one without using the RTS kit. I believe he has gotten his hands very dirty in the code, though. You're a bit off on your thoughts about only being able to make first or third person games, though. That's a misconception. Look at the feature demo and you'll notice camera paths for cinematics or fixed-camera titles (survival horror or adventure games usually fit this model best). You could also check out some of the GiD (game in a day) stuff that has been done in TGE.

3DGS is a great engine. My only problem with it is later optimization and networking (not that I use networking anyway...but still). And that it is Windows only. But I don't discount it as a great engine. But I don't think flexible is the word you're looking for. Instead, I'm thinking "lower-entry bar on variant game-types" is a better, though, longer thought.

But here's another question, one for you that will help you make your decision.

What is your experience? What is your programming experience? What is your target market? Is cross-platform compatability on your plate? Do you need advanced and fine-tuned networking? Do you need advanced physics? Are you simply looking to prototype until you find the "right" game or are you looking at trying to make a single exciting game (to start)? How is your artflow? What is your artflow? Are there importers/exporters available for the engines you are looking at? Are you working alone or on a team? If you are working alone, what are your self-management skills (this comes back to the first question about experience)?

Take your answers and write them up. Next, make a list of the kind of games you want to make. Scale it accordingly. If you're just you, don't plan on making Resident Evil 4 or Warcraft 3. The content alone would take a team more man-hours than you probably have available. Look at them each in terms of feasibility from terms of your experience, your target, and your team (you know, the first list you made). Now that you have a good idea of feasible game ideas, you can adequately look at the engines available.

I'm a huge fan of Torque, but I also know that it's not for everybody. Neither is 3DGS or Nebula or Unity or Blitz3D. But they are for some.

#5 Wow, thanks for the great replies.

I'm actually more interested in creating Adventure games than anything else. I've been a fan of the genre since the early 90s, and it's always been a dream to create my own. I have a nice bit programming experience (though, not C++), I'm a graphic designer by profession.. and I've also dabbled in some audio & video production. My target audience is the small group of fans of the adventure genre. I'm not looking to change the world, and I'm not looking to make money .. I just want produce a game that people can enjoy.

Honestly, the most important things I'm looking for are:
- Ability to script a dialogue system for talking to characters, possibly including voiceovers. And I'd definitely want their mouths to move when they talk. 3DGS can do this, I've seen it done, although I'm not sure about Torque.
- Animations/cutscenes
- Flexible camera movement like you mentioned above
- Customizable in-game interface (for inventory, etc)
- Third Person View
- Pathfinding for NPCs & Possibly AI

The thing is, I don't really want to have to dig in and modify the source code, as I don't know too much about C++. I've learned a few programming languages in full... but I always stumble when trying to learn C++. TorqueScript seems fairly easy to adapt to. I've seen snippets of code, and it seems to be pretty simple to understand.

I don't know if any of you have played the newly released "Dreamfall: The Longest Journey", but that's basically the overall type of game I'm hoping to develop.

Does this sound feesable?


Thanks again,
Adam

#6 Content will be your main problem. TLJ (and adventure games traditionally) are content-heavy. Your AI should be relatively simple to implement as adventure games aren't (usually) AI heavy. There is an inventory resource readily available. It's a bit robust for what you'd need, but it's not hard to scale back. You will need to model your vocal deformation in both TGE and A6 and blend them as needed. DarkVoices for DarkBasic is about the closest to a Mimic/Magpie Pro/etc, and then there are some specifics for the mesh control. I've never worked with this in either TGE or A6, though. I would recommend Stop Staring if you're not up to speed with facial animation and expressions. It's for Maya but can be translated to any modeling package.

You can do everything on your list in either engine, though. You could also do it rather nicely in Unity or BeyondVirtual.