Can t2d do 2d mmorpgs?
by Ryan Setten · in Torque Game Builder · 10/07/2005 (12:01 pm) · 16 replies
Exactly what the title asks. Can the T2D engine build an mmorpg of marketable quality with a team developing it?
I know TGE is a well written engine. I messed around with tribes editor which im told was built from the TGE and know that it was capable for making fun 3d games. (fps style, even though a tribes RPG was created as well)
However, is the T2D a viable engine to make games on par with Ragnarok online, or Dark Ages. Two popular 2d mmorpgs. There is obviously a market for these types of games. However, I do not know which engines they run off of, or if they run their own independent game engines.
Here are links to those two games as an example:
www.darkages.com
http://iro.ragnarokonline.com/
Is it capable of creating a game on par or even more powerful then those?
The online portion of the game would have to be developed independent obviously.If I were to license this for my co. and give it to someone who's well versed in programming, would they be able to use it for an 2dmmorpg or is this engine just not right for that?
If it's not, is there an engine that I should check out? There are hardly any search resaults for good 2d game engines on the net other then this one. Which is reoccuring no matter which search engine or terms I use.
Thanks for your time.
I know TGE is a well written engine. I messed around with tribes editor which im told was built from the TGE and know that it was capable for making fun 3d games. (fps style, even though a tribes RPG was created as well)
However, is the T2D a viable engine to make games on par with Ragnarok online, or Dark Ages. Two popular 2d mmorpgs. There is obviously a market for these types of games. However, I do not know which engines they run off of, or if they run their own independent game engines.
Here are links to those two games as an example:
www.darkages.com
http://iro.ragnarokonline.com/
Is it capable of creating a game on par or even more powerful then those?
The online portion of the game would have to be developed independent obviously.If I were to license this for my co. and give it to someone who's well versed in programming, would they be able to use it for an 2dmmorpg or is this engine just not right for that?
If it's not, is there an engine that I should check out? There are hardly any search resaults for good 2d game engines on the net other then this one. Which is reoccuring no matter which search engine or terms I use.
Thanks for your time.
#2
I need to find a viable solution for making a 2dmmorpg. Would this be realistic?
Thanks for the help
10/07/2005 (12:19 pm)
What is the a-typical engine or way of making a 2d mmorpg now? As far as a good team, that would be taken care of. The question is, would it be practical to use T2D or a trying to use a square peg for a round hole. It would take alot more time to make it a round peg then simply finding a square hole for it to go in. Know what I mean? I need to find a viable solution for making a 2dmmorpg. Would this be realistic?
Thanks for the help
#3
10/07/2005 (12:21 pm)
It would have to be somewhat powerful as well. I'd really hate to have to get a programmer to make an engine from scratch, but thats what it's looking like.
#4
10/07/2005 (12:23 pm)
It would have to be somewhat powerful as well. I'd really hate to have to get a programmer to make an engine from scratch, but thats what it's looking like. 
#5
But those are simple slivers of the massive amount of work that it takes to create a MMORPG.
10/07/2005 (12:27 pm)
How are your programming skills? Making a MMORPG, whether 2D or 3D is a major undertaking. Extremely major. The number of MMORPG maker engines that pop up is rather impressive, though they usually die within a couple of months since it takes major work to create a useful engine. And that is not as impressive. Most of the ones on the market are using their own engines, built from the ground up. T2D would be a good start, but it would require some major work regardless. TNL provides a master server to play with in testing. The TGE resource for SQL integration will get you on your feet with database connectivity quickly.But those are simple slivers of the massive amount of work that it takes to create a MMORPG.
#6
10/07/2005 (12:30 pm)
Let's see. $20 an hour (cheap) for 40 hours a week (no overtime on a budget!) for six months = $19,200 or so. Then there are employee benefits, taxes, etc.
#7
I got it to the point where you can connect, log in, create a new character or select an existing one, and enter the game.
So yes, I would say its possible to use T2D as a client for a multiplayer game. Specifically because multiplayer games are more dependant on the server than the client.
10/07/2005 (12:38 pm)
I have created a server for what could be deemed a space based mmorpg. I bought T2d a while back and integrated my network library into it. I took a break due to family issues, but I'm planning on getting back into it. I used the normal T2D gui elements to create the login screens.I got it to the point where you can connect, log in, create a new character or select an existing one, and enter the game.
So yes, I would say its possible to use T2D as a client for a multiplayer game. Specifically because multiplayer games are more dependant on the server than the client.
#8
10/07/2005 (2:03 pm)
Please do not hit "refresh" after making a post as a means to look to see if there are any responses. Instead, click on the thread title. "Refresh" posts your last message again and again!
#9
The best you can hope for is to pick up a programming language, learn it thoroughly. Then learn to make small games, working your way up to networking. Then maybe you can start trying to make an MMORPG. Your next best hope is to have lots of disposable cash to "buy" a team to write it for you, which is usually unlikely.
It takes a lot of dedication and time to become a programmer, then it takes even more to become a good programmer. There isn't a "Just add Water" solution.
10/07/2005 (2:40 pm)
If you aren't a programmer, and I assume the CEO friend isn't either, you aren't going to make an mmorpg. There isn't any "MMORPG in a box" software that you can buy and just set up, it really doesn't work that way. The best you can hope for is to pick up a programming language, learn it thoroughly. Then learn to make small games, working your way up to networking. Then maybe you can start trying to make an MMORPG. Your next best hope is to have lots of disposable cash to "buy" a team to write it for you, which is usually unlikely.
It takes a lot of dedication and time to become a programmer, then it takes even more to become a good programmer. There isn't a "Just add Water" solution.
#10
If I were looking to create a 3d mmorpg, I'd simply use the gamebryo game engine, and haviks physic engines. The thing is, I'm not again, am not looking to be the programmer of the project. Nor is the CEO, the programmer/s would obviously be hired to fill that position.
However, I'm looking for software to license to make their job easier. Paying a programmer/s to write an entirely new engine for a game wouldn't be as cost effective and tweaking on already in existance. And since this is a market I'm not familiar with. This is the only 2d game engine readily available that can be built upon to make a final product. (or am I wrong)
That being said. It looks like it would be easier to use a 3d engine and fake a 2d mmorpg rather then using a 2d engine.
I'm not looking for "instant grat" I'm not looking for an "add water" solution. I'm looking for a viable starting point to invest in that the programming team could then go to town with. I'm sorry I'm not a programmer. But I became intersted in this product since it's the only thing the search engines came up with. And because I had an affinety for the tribes editor, which is why garage games was something I remembered.
This probably isn't want I'm looking for than, thanks for the help.
10/07/2005 (3:22 pm)
I think your misinterpreting where I'm coming from. If I were looking to create a 3d mmorpg, I'd simply use the gamebryo game engine, and haviks physic engines. The thing is, I'm not again, am not looking to be the programmer of the project. Nor is the CEO, the programmer/s would obviously be hired to fill that position.
However, I'm looking for software to license to make their job easier. Paying a programmer/s to write an entirely new engine for a game wouldn't be as cost effective and tweaking on already in existance. And since this is a market I'm not familiar with. This is the only 2d game engine readily available that can be built upon to make a final product. (or am I wrong)
That being said. It looks like it would be easier to use a 3d engine and fake a 2d mmorpg rather then using a 2d engine.
I'm not looking for "instant grat" I'm not looking for an "add water" solution. I'm looking for a viable starting point to invest in that the programming team could then go to town with. I'm sorry I'm not a programmer. But I became intersted in this product since it's the only thing the search engines came up with. And because I had an affinety for the tribes editor, which is why garage games was something I remembered.
This probably isn't want I'm looking for than, thanks for the help.
#11
The add water solutions being designed. After being taken away from the original concept of the game to strictly "business"
10/07/2005 (3:33 pm)
Btw, www.sojdev.com -> meta4.com The add water solutions being designed. After being taken away from the original concept of the game to strictly "business"
#12
Torque2d is a fine starting point for a 2d client, and you could probably do everything you need for it in torquescript. However, it isn't a server, it isn't meant to be. You would still need to write a back end server for the client to connect to, and at this point you would also need to write the networking into T2d like I did, or figure out how to integrate TNL.
What I'm saying is no matter what "engine" you buy, you are going to have to make extensive changes to the code base to become remotely marketable. No one is going to pay for "Generic MMORPG #134". If you want to have some kind of a starting point I would look at existing MM servers but I would also question as to what problems existing customers are having. Starting from a crappy codebase is worse than making your own from scratch.
If I were going to try at making a 2d mmorpg and time was a factor I would look at taking an existing mud codebase with a coordinal system (rather than a room based system) and I would create a networking layer to work with Torque2d.
10/11/2005 (11:42 am)
Except add water solutions will never "work" when you are trying to make money. Take MUD's for instance. The only commercially viable ones are the ones that took a code base and did EXTENSIVE changes to it. They aren't anything like the code they started out with. Everquest is a mud, completely recoded with a seperate graphical client that connects to it.Torque2d is a fine starting point for a 2d client, and you could probably do everything you need for it in torquescript. However, it isn't a server, it isn't meant to be. You would still need to write a back end server for the client to connect to, and at this point you would also need to write the networking into T2d like I did, or figure out how to integrate TNL.
What I'm saying is no matter what "engine" you buy, you are going to have to make extensive changes to the code base to become remotely marketable. No one is going to pay for "Generic MMORPG #134". If you want to have some kind of a starting point I would look at existing MM servers but I would also question as to what problems existing customers are having. Starting from a crappy codebase is worse than making your own from scratch.
If I were going to try at making a 2d mmorpg and time was a factor I would look at taking an existing mud codebase with a coordinal system (rather than a room based system) and I would create a networking layer to work with Torque2d.
#13
it is like the "RTS Starter Kits" in GarageGames but this is fully mmorpg. I think GG must sell something simillar to this, i am pretty sure they will earn lot of money because Torque is better as engine and all the programming concepts people will acquire with this potential Starter Kit, all the concepts in one Kit, fascinating.
i am more interested in the database communication using Torque, these days.
regards,
matt.
10/12/2005 (6:02 am)
Hey guys, there are a team that is working on other game programming languaje (Blitz3D and BlitzPlus) and they are creating an engine for mmorpg creation. But, the good news is that they will sell the license of the source code.it is like the "RTS Starter Kits" in GarageGames but this is fully mmorpg. I think GG must sell something simillar to this, i am pretty sure they will earn lot of money because Torque is better as engine and all the programming concepts people will acquire with this potential Starter Kit, all the concepts in one Kit, fascinating.
i am more interested in the database communication using Torque, these days.
regards,
matt.
#14
10/12/2005 (7:37 am)
There are several resources that describe (and give code for) how to connect a Torque server to a database.
#15
case in point: IRC: that could be your entire network layer right there if you really wanted. (i'm not saying it'd be good, but it would let you have tens of thousands of players "online"
10/12/2005 (10:12 am)
Honestly, i think a "MMO" is pretty damn simple.case in point: IRC: that could be your entire network layer right there if you really wanted. (i'm not saying it'd be good, but it would let you have tens of thousands of players "online"
#16
Right?
03/12/2006 (1:22 pm)
This is an old thread but I was just wondering... Couldn't you use t2d to actually make the server program for your t2d online game? Would it be possible to do that, and run it on a seperate machine in your house, which would act as a dedicated server? Then you could use your server program to view players, stats, store data, etc...Right?
Associate David Montgomery-Blake
David MontgomeryBlake
It is possible but I don't know if it is viable unless you have an excellent team onboard.