Do you think violent video games make people violent?

#41 I think its funny how a big proportion of violent games are taken from real world scenarios not the other way around e.g grand theft auto, any war game, medal of honour Battlefield, and Unreal Tornament... (just kidding) etc.

I do think that games should have a rating, but I dont think that any should be banned. I can decide for myself if the game is too violent or not ( I never think that will happen ). Most of the time the violent ones are the most fun! Untill stealing an instance of the wheeledVehicle() class is made illegal i'm gonna keep on doin it. =)

computers don't kill people, people kill people!

#42

Quote:But what if kids read violent novels like...

Or what if kids read and are taught one of the most violent books in existence... The Holy Bible

#43 I don't think that games, tv, or other forms of media *make* people violent. I think perhaps that they can induce already violent or disturbed people to commit violence, along with other factors, but those people were made violent by other means.

It's way too simplistic to suggest that one form of media, or that one single event, changes anyone enough to commit a heinous act. The truth, one that society doesn't necessarily want to believe, is that there are a lot of factors involved in having someone turn into a homicidal axe (or gun) wielding maniac. Unfortunately, this fact makes it hard for lawyers to determine the responsibility necessary to successfully sue those they deem responsible.

#44

Quote:Or what if kids read and are taught one of the most violent books in existence... The Holy Bible

Not just the bible, all religions holy books. Just because most wars are based on religious differences doesn't mean we can blame that instead of games... does it??? :)

#45 Games our one form of media. Are they gonna ban violent movies and TV shows? Are they gonna ban books?

#46 This has most likely been said above...

Violent video games may attract violent people who play video games, but they do not convert people to violence.

I always have to chuckle at (and fear) people in power who even consider the idea that this may be true, as the proof is all there...

If games "converted" people against their nature, I and 80%+ of the population would be killing each other and racing at top speed down the freeway with a DIY nitrous booster installed.

I can say the same for music as well... It may get the blood pumping if your already agro, but it wont convert you.

At very most, violent video games can give violent people an innovative idea.

-Jeff

#47

Quote:Man, that's just not cool and not always true. This is a simular situation with my cousin. She has grown up on video games and usually was neglected through her childhood and she isn't violent in real-life.

I didn't mean it like that. I meant it more in a way that if parents took notice of what their kids were doing rather than relying on video games, TV etc to "babysit" then they'd notice their kids behaviour changing and what they got up to and possibly stop things happening. That and most of the incidents are done in America yet gun laws remain unchanged.

All this is of course based on a small group of people who have trouble distinguishing reality from games, TV etc. Which your cousin seems (as most people do) to understand.

#48 [the following is simply my opinion, take it or leave it :) ]

Too much of the parent blaming others instead of taking responsibility for them. Until a child is a certain age I don't beleive they are completely responsible for themselves, they are still learning, they are still naive to a lot of things, as they age then they slowly get met with responsibility (well at least theoretically this would be ideal in my mind). Until that point their parent's are responsible for them, since they haven't been exposed to the world long enough to know the full extent of many things, thats where the parent is supposed to come in. A parent isn't supposed to be a best friend all the time, I see to much of that these days, parents affraid of losing their child's friendship. If they don't be a parent then most likely no one will, with no guidance a child can take anything and get the wrong impression since they are still naive to the full extent of many things, books, games, movies.

Violence is part of our society, world, and reality. It always has been and always will be. Its part of history, religion, religious history, etc. By the same standards these people are enforcing (many of them being Christians, btw I am a Christian as well), if they were to take the same measure and apply it to the Holy Bible it would probably be the most vile peice of media in existence (or fairly close). Dealing with prostitutes, homosexuality, sodomy, death, betrayal, murder of children, etc. Many of these people don't attempt to look at these things deep enough to see it, its a shame, but thats a reality to.

You can't hide from violence, its part of our existence, if you do you get naive children that pick up any large dose of it (which can even be walking the streets and seeing a fight, or getting mugged) and they don't know how to process it. Thats where the parents are supposed to educate there children, but they arent.



Though just as much as violence is a reality and they should accept that and teach about it instead of avoid it, we must accept that life and the world isn't fair. Thats a reality to and we're just as bad if we deny it and don't approach it appropriately. That doesn't mean we can't do anything about it, simply that you should accept that things aren't going to be fair and people aren't always going to see your side, so you must approach it in a calculated way, either by accepting it and working around it, or by attempting to change it.

#49 So... too much love in movies and TV must've desensitized the populace and that's why the divorce rate is so high?

I'm not so sure I believe the whole desensitization theory. If that were a fact, then I should have no problem going to rotten dot com (don't go there) or any of the similar sites. But I can't, and I won't. I have a huge aversion to the real blood and guts that are displayed on those sites, yet movies don't even make me feel anywhere near as close.

I just think that lawyers are looking for a reason to perpetuate their kind, they need something to justify their presence so they invent BS like violence in videogames causes kids to be violent.

If it's true, I'm gonna latch onto the first statement I made and start suing the movie and TV industry for making people get divorced.

- Brett

#50

Quote:So... too much love in movies and TV must've desensitized the populace and that's why the divorce rate is so high?

In a sense, yes. The process of thought I see is just replacing words in the same statement. When desensitized to violence :
"Violence happens." instead of "Violence is a terrible thing."
Like.
"Love happens." instead of "Love is a wonderful thing."

The attitudes become that both are these everyday occurences that can be, will be, and should be done in our ever increasing-in-speed world. Both are nothing special - hence the process of desensitization. The synonymous definitions at thesaurus.reference.com listed for desensitize are "dull", "diminish", "medicate", and "deaden" - first two of which could be used in place could be used in place of the word desensitize.

And to this opinion I again submit there is always exceptions on both sides of every arguement, but the idea that media (not just video games by any means) adds a degree into the desensitizing of all exposed to it in regards to violence stands valid in my eye.

#51 Violence has established multiple countries... it resulted in the US seperating from Brittain, slaves being freed from their masters, and numerous other good results have come from violence.

Personally I don't think Violence is a terrible thing, I think it needs to be taught what violence is, what in-appropriate violence is, what appropriate violence (specifically in the past) has been and why. This distinction is what those kids seem to lack (the ones that go to their schools and shoot their classmates). In the same manner I think a parent needs to show their kids violent games and help them realize the distinction between fantasy and reality, this isn't true just in games, people can get themselves in trouble in a failed distinction between the two in many things.

#52 There is no such thing as good violence. There can be appropriate, or necessary violence... but never good violence. It is always best if avoided.

As for games causing violent behaviour... The US and Canda (at least) are free countries... We can make and sell whatever games we want to sell. We have a right to do so. They can make it illegal to sell those games to anyone under 18, but that is probably a good thing...

People are free to make there own decisions. If they choose to be violent, a game did not force them to make that decision... nor did it encourage it.

#53 I try to stay clear of complete absolutes like that. such as "but never good violence."

Like Obi-Wan said, the Sith are the only ones who deal in absolutes... (lol ok some lame humor to lighten the mood).

For example some argue that the U.S. dropping nuclear bombs on Nagasaki and Hiroshima actually prevented deaths, mainly because it ended the warring between the U.S. and Japan which could have ended with many more deaths between both sides than the nuclear bombs resulted in. I'm not supporting it, just pointing out a counter argument that does have merrit (whether I agree or not I do admit it has merrit)... the opposite of that obviously is that dropping nuclear bombs and killing innocents as well as military troops isn't a good thing. People think differently, it doesn't mean that one is right and one is wrong, at least in my opinion it doesn't. I'm very careful about absolutes. Just some more opinions from a crazy programmer ;)

#54 Mathew. Yes I can see that there can be a benefit to violence... It can be neccesary and acceptable... but that doesn't ever make it good. Violence is just, well in my opinion, a bad thing.

Mind you a lot of what some people think is violence really isn't.

#55 Yes I think violent video games CAN make children violent.

Adults are not so much influenced as by this stage of development we already have a very good sense of right or wrong. However a child is another matter entirely. Children take pretty much everything they see and hear as fact until told otherwise. A five to twelve year old playing GFA isn't likely to think it's just a game and is likely to try out the moves on their friends just for fun.

I think the violence aspect is ok as long as the games are then sold and played by consenting adults and not bought and gievn to young children whose minds are easily influenced.

Give a starving man a sword and you have one dangerous starving man....teach a starving man to create a sword and you have one dangerous starving general!

#56 I like this thread. This is what is cool about the game development field. It's full of people who care about being intelligent and wise. I like how everyone clearly has their own thought out opinions about this subject. Ussually you will see a discussion like this filled with political retoric where no everyone states what some politician or political commentator(however you spell that) has been saying. And you guys are all thinking about both the big and little picture. About the history of the relationship between violence and media. About how it may or may not affect different people in different ways. I could go on and on about how impressive this discussion is. And so far nobody has called anybody any names. Good for us. Now to my thoughts.


Do children have the ability to realize that violence in games is dangerous in real life. I suspect so. I have seen that children have an instict or understanding of danger and suffering. Consider that babies are afraid of heights. Remember how scared you were of horror movies as a kid? For years parents have used spanking to help steer children away from dangers that are not natural such as fire. I don't personally favor spanking, but it is a fact that children avoid things that cause pain. I think that if children are taught that something causes pain that they will steer clear of it. Man, when I was a kid I loved westerns. Guns were the coolest. The Outlaw Josey Wales. And James Bond movies. Loved them. One day I was watching a tv show where a couple of kids were playing with a gun and the father found them. He took them out to the garden and showed them what happens when you shoot a watermelon. That scared the crap out of me. I must have been 4 or 5 years old and I understood that shooting something causes irreversable damage. I still loved westerns and James Bond, but I would never play with a gun in real life. So, I am of the opinion that children who's parents explain that violence in real life is bad, will avoid violence.

#57 People have been violent long before video games and will likely still be violent long after video games are lost to history. That is, if the collective 'we' should survive that long!

When I was a little kid, my parents wouldn't let me watch this 70's television show called S.W.A.T. because they said that it was too violent. My friends of course would be ranting and raving about how cool it was. The show was probably tame by modern standards (I still haven't seen an episode, but I did watch the bucket-o-pharts movie).

Blaming violence on pop culture consumables is lazy, dangerous, and incredibly ignorant. I mean, when you hear about some mass murderer or serial killer on the local or national news, are you more likely to hear that the killer listened to Kelly Clarkson or that they listened to Slipknot? What were Ted Bundy or Jeffery Dahmer's[sp] favorite music or movies? What books did they read? Why do we know what the kids at Columbine were into?

#58 Survey of parents to discover how they reacted to age ratings:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/4118270.stm

#59 I think in the generalised picture, violent video games make a minority of people more violent but does not affect the majority of people.

Now in the UK (not sure if it's the same elsewhere) we have PEGI age ratings which aren't legal ratings more of a guide line. However the likes of Grand Theft Auto gets submitted to the BBFC which are legal ratings and can not be bought by people under the rated age. Not all games go through the BBFC as it's not a requirement.

So on to my question: Should parents who buy 18 rated games for their kids be charged with a criminal offense?

#60 I think it all relates back to the days when watching too many cartoons was said to make people violent. Although it is true some cartoons depict violence, when they do it is usually in the form of an acme anvil falling on someone, or a grand piano falling 20 stories and landing on a pedestrian. If cartoons made people violent than those things would happen in real life, but they didn't. There has always been scapegoats for violent people, but as technology changes so do their excuses.

Personally I think the emphasis (in the States at least) on the military as a symbol of power is what makes children grow to be violent. If you raise them idolizing people who shoot guns, thats what their going to want to do. Don't get me wrong, you need an army, I can understand that, and an army should be thanked for risking their lives, but the more it happens the more violent children will get. It's a vicious cycle, and I guess the only answer would be to prevent child knowledge of the army, although that leads to problems in itself.