Interesting Xbox 2/PC Convergence...

#1 Why would RTS games be an exception? I would think the exceptions would be those titles that target only a specific piece of hardware in hopes of becoming a bundle deal. Perhaps I'm lost. I often am.

#2 Well, I say RTS because they are generally difficult to translate to the console...

However, MS has also made an exact reference to the possibility of a a game that has someone on the PC commanding around soldiers, while players on the Xbox 2 are those soldiers in a first person shooter.

#3 Most games have rather extensive control issues when ported between consoles or PC's. For example, FPS's often have to adjust speed like crazy for the quick precision of the mouse versus analog control. Or how a game like Ape Escape would have to be modified to remove dual analog control (and even on the PSP, the removal is sketchy at best as you often look as if you're lined up perfectly but the camera and the control isn't as precise as your monkey hunting abilities make it seem).

#4 I dunno, but that sounds a lot easier then the current status of porting, which can often require rewrites of very large portions of code, like rendering code and resource managers.

#5 Definitely, but porting the gameplay between the two will still be a nightmare.

#6 I don't agree..... However, I have never done it either.

It sounds to me like you are taking sometihng that is extremely positive for the indie commnuity and making it sound like it doesn't matter.

Noone said you didn't have to port anything. I would rather port gameplay, which isn't relatively complicated, then port rendering code...

#7 I never said that it didn't matter or that it wouldn't make portability easier.

I'm just a skeptic when it comes to a panacea in gaming. Especially in portability between a static platform such as a console and a dynamic platform like a PC. One of the major benefits of console development is the stability of the target hardware. You don't have to test for several graphics cards with a wide variety of feature implementations between assorted driver versions. Porting and testing will always be a big job. Intiatives like this make the process easier (or perhaps more accurately, they make it more defined so that it's easier to know where and what needs to be changed during the porting process).

#8 @David - I am with you on the skepticism... I don't think they will open up the platform to allow indies to develop for it without purchasing a dev kit. As far as Im concerned untl someone plops an xbox2 ide into my lap for my pc, I won't believe these rumours...

EDIT: One thing they could do is make the development environment platform specific... For example, making the x2 devkit compatible with x2 as well as The XXX Mac... So that if you have an XXX Mac you can develop for the X2.

#9 Porting the controls will be the most difficult thing. Making your game work on a controler is something that takes many revisions and lots of tweeking. It's not something that you can look up and plop in.

Porting to the hardware? That won't be difficult if you pick the right engine.

#10 Yeah, controllers and save games are often what people often fail on when submitting ther games to console Q&A testing. I'm not sure how Xbox 2 would compare to Xbox 1 as far as porting goes. Will be interesting to see just what XNA is capable of.

#11 Yes...controler pulls >.< They're enough to make you cry.

Oh your game doesn't react correctly if someone pulls out the network cable, and then the controler as soon as the loading screen dissapears...you faaaaailll!

It's why I quietly laugh to myself every time I see someone who is sure their game idea is built for the console.

Edit: Not that doing things for a console is bad. It's actually great as far as knowing if it works on one system it'll work on all of them. The dev tools are second to none on the Xbox, also.

#12 Or they could just release a USB Xbox controller and an Xbox Keyboard and Mouse and recommend them with each game on their online marketplace. It's finally coming to the point where gamers are older and have the money to buy accessories. Heck, the way MS is looking they're going to make the XBox and the PC one thing anyway.

#13 Not to be nitpicky but it's the XBOX 360 , there is no XBOX 2 ;)

and in other news - apparently it will be backwards compatible with the XBOX, and if I read the article right, an XBOX 360 can play the same game vs. an XBOX on their Live system.

#14 Backwards compatible if you buy the system with the HD, for about an extra hundred bucks..

#15

Quote:A very interesting way this connectivity could be used, imo, is the PC for modding. As in, the developer releases a bunch of modding tools for the PC, then the modders can create a mod for both the PC and Xbox 2, then post it up on the Marketplace and sell it for cheap.

I just wanted to know how anyone can make money off mods? One of the restrictions is non comercial use, the switch of platforms wont make a difference.

#16 People need to stop supporting Microsoft. Their anticompetitive business practices deserve that.

#17 Go for it, if that's your thing. They're one of the few companies who are doing things for indies, and certainly the biggest one.

http://www.gamedev.net/community/forums/topic.asp?topic_id=316343

#18 Sorry, had to chime in here Midhirs' comment
[Soapbox]
That has to be the biggest log of turd that most people who have no knowledge of how Microsoft works spurt just to make themselves sound like there raging against the machine.

It's MS's house. As far as I'm concerned they can put anything they like in there.

How would you like it if you created a product and where told that you couldn't do something because it would stop others from doing the same thing?

Almost every product that ships with Windows is at the most, basic. There is room to improve on every bit of it.

Oh I won't even start on how Big ole evil Bill gates, with his Iron grip on the software business donates millions upon millions of dollars a year (over his tax write-offs) to different charities and programs.
Not the least what he does on the humanitarian front.

If your going to hate MS for something, do it for something they have done to you personally. Not some regurgitated garbage that you read on Slashdot that 9 out of 10 times has to do with some business being sour because either A) MS beat them to it or B) they made something better.
or C) there product may be better but people aren't going to want to spend the money on it. Well guess what. Some people don't have the money to pay for extra stuff.

So yeah, let's go hate and sue MS for trying to make our life easier.

Or even better, let's hate Microsoft for the same reason that we like Unix. Because they give us free alternatives.

I'm done
[/Soapbox]

#19 Actually, it's usually B that people have a problem with. Microsoft usually doesn't do anything better, they just do it consistently. And they have a consistent business name and support reputation. Their R&D division has some of the most amazing minds in the industry in it and yet they ignore a good 98% of what comes out of it to support their consistent business assets.

But a good part of that is dependent on being business oriented versus being tech oriented. They see what works and emulate it the next year. If they can't emulate it, they buy out or partner with companies that can. They are an excellent business. Sure, they do engage in "illicit" business practices in hopes of not getting caught, but when one works on that level in so many world markets, you have to take a number of huge-scale risks. Sometimes they make mistakes, and the mistakes on that level are huge in comparison to the mistakes we make.

Microsoft is a huge company that has had very good and consistent business vision.

But it comes down to vision. To the normal Slashdotter, Microsoft is evil since they embody the commercial horror stories that the open source community disseminates as a tech-oriented community. Free software is frightening to MS because they lose commercial control. Their .NET initiative is an interesting tentative step into the tech-oriented community.

I understand where both sides come from. Neither one is right or wrong. When we look at the industry coin, we like to create black/white dilineations when there are a million shades of gray.

#20 David, we regret to inform you that, due to a lack of loud and mindless opinion spewing, we will have to revoke your posting rights. ;)

That was one of the more accurate, profound and consice statements I've heard about Microsoft on a messageboard.