Logo Requirement Now On Product Page

#21 I have no problem displaying the GG logo at the start up of my game but I was wondering if its possible to display the garage games logo on a graphic that I created. My plan was to have the main characters of my game interact with the garage games logo in a short start up sort of skit. I guess my question is, do I have to use the GG logo that comes with the starter kits or can I display the garage games logo at start up using another method say an animation.

#22

Argh, for God's sake let this topic die a peaceful death!

The original poster who started this even went as far as to post a public apology, and admitted that yes, the commerical license exists with no logo requirement. I noticed he hasn't been replying to these threads, so it looks like he's moved on.

Why can't the rest of us?

Jeff: I am sorry that people can be such goobers. During the time I have been a member of GG's site, I have seen the EULA change on a few occasions -- and it has always been for the better of the end users. GG isn't tightening the thumb screws, in fact as a general trend they're doing just the opposite, as much as they can and still remain in business.

"OMG $400 is too much for a 2D engine!" Well, go write one of your own! If you can't afford it but MUST use T2D and CAN'T write your own, then stay within the indie publishing requirements. This isn't rocket science, people.

(As for T2D costing too much -- Go hire a contracter to write an equivalent engine to T2D for your projects. I bet they will charge more than $400... And if you implement it on your own, I also bet you will spend more than $400's worth of man-hours on it. And no, I don't consider XYZ engine to be a viable alternative to T2D, as none of them have the same level of functionality as T2D coupled with a flexible scripting language AND a fair and easy to understand license. Not a slam against the other 2D engines, this is just fact.)

Argh. It's just...retarded that this has been made into such a big deal. I fully %100 support the IG.com admin who keeps locking the topics. I just wish GG did the same on here.

#23 1) The EULA is a contract...
2) Intelligent people read contracts FULLY before agreeing and signing...
3) GG's EULA is a great contract (thanks Jeff)...
4) TGE, TSE, and T2D are easily worth 10 times the price - even for
Commercial (again, thanks Jeff)...
5) I'll be upgrading to Commercial for all but will still use the logo...
6) Agree with previous posts - just friggin' tired of seeing this pop up in Unread
Posts on multiple sites. I'm not a knowledgeable contributor to the forums
here yet, still learning, but I get a LOT of info here that really helps. Now we
have people who HAVEN'T EVEN BOUGHT TORQUE complaining. When my kids
acted like this I sent them to their room...

* last and only 2 cent post on this matter, back to important things...

#24 Jeff, please don't dislike us because of the actions of one person. Most of us indie developers know what we are doing and fully appriciate what GG, including yourself, have done for us!

Plus, it is my opinion that anyone who buys something they will use to create something they can sell and doesn't read the license for it, that person is too unprofessional to create a game.

#25 Jesus this pisses me off. How the *hell* can people complain about the logo thing? GG offers the best engine deal full stop. The internet is so full of people who are so pissed they aren't more important they smack talk about everything.

Ian

#26 $400 for an engine, especially T2D is a great deal IMO. But if you already bought full use of the engine for a greater deal at $100 and there's no chance in hell that you are going to make $250,000 in sales (lets be real here) then going out and paying $300 more for the same engine is a huge waste of money. If your purpose is to contribute to GG and donate that money then fine but I honestly can't see the point of blowing $300 because of a 2 second logo, espeically if your on a budget. Now for my next question....why do I even care? I'm done with this too.
-Ajari-

#27 The original poster was basically creating a problem where none existed. It's not like they developed their game, finished it, released it, made a bunch of money, then had GG sue them for breach of license for not putting the start-up logo on the screen.

People with too much time on their hands, the anonymity of the internet, frustrated creatives (or non-creatives), and the fact that when dealing with the general public you're going to span the whole range between fanboys and complainers... that's the cocktail that created this non-issue.

Garage Games is a success and anytime something is successful it's going to draw fire. Expect more of it as GG continues to succeed. But the upside is expect people to send you free beer once in a while too!

#28 Just because its not an issue to you, doesnt mean its not an issue to someone else. Just as that joke could be deemed offensive by some (which I'll be remembering to tell my mates later:-)

Part of being in business is dealing with strangers unrealistic expectations, but thats only your perspective, the customer also has theirs.

I had a guy raking me over the coals because I called a PC's PSU a power supply, when technically you could argue its a power regulator or converter. The guy was clutching a copy of the 12v bible usually used by sailors and the like. Me, I only served an apprenticeship in electronics servicing, what would *I* know. He was very annoying, but I was polite throughout despite him wanting to know the far end of a fart (whats the manufacturer of the ram 'chips', not the stick its on etc.... Would I guarantee its servicing if he is in the Bahamas (No, there is no service outlet on the islands you want to go to, how do I know sir? I used to live on two of the islands you mention...) It may have been annoying to me, but he wanted to be sure it would work on his yacht while sailing around.

Its just perspective.

#29 Honestly, any kind of sap who doesn't read the EULA when licensing a game engine really doesn't need to be trying their hand at game design in the first place. I read over the TGE EULA for a good long while before finally deciding to make the purchase myself.

And just to mention there are a LOT of big commercial projects that require full splash screens, which can be easily noted just from starting up any game that runs on a Renderware platform or uses ADX media.

#30 ----

#31 True, its your responsibility to read a contract you are entering into. I have read it. It stopped me getting Torque when it first came out and made me look elsewhere. But since they changed it to its current form...... Well, I'm here, and wishing that maybe I'd gone and gotten it anyway.

#32 @Mark: What was it about the old terms that made you decide to pass the 1st time? What have they changed that has brought you back?
-Ajari-

#33 I must say, the dead horse is probably a bloody, pulpy mess by now and not even recognizable as what it used to be. I play many console games and almost all of them have at least 3 or more quick spash screens that appear (and there's no escape key!!!). I think of the Metroid Prime series, they have several. No biggie at all, you just wait a few seconds. Is it that difficult for someone to start up a game and have to wait a total of 10 seconds to play? Clean your fingernails or somehting while you wait if it bothers you that much to wait for 10 seconds of your life.

In fact, reading this post probably took you a good half minute...you could have your game up and running by now while you read this.

To Jeff and the whole gang at Garage Games: You guys are fantastic and wonderful and put out a good product. Keep up the good work and those of us that know how hard you work and your dedication to the Indie community will continue to support you.

And clean your fingernails. Everyone around you will be much happier.

#34 Ajari, if my memory serves (hey, theres always a first time, right?) it was the must be distributed by GarageGames bit. I was at the time speaking with the author of an RPG from the late 70's early 80's about bringing it to the PC. Having someone else even mention controlling the distribution channel gave me the willies as at the time it was me and a friend who would fund the core deveolpment before approaching my mates former employer (a games publisher) to secure final development and distribution/promotion. I probably should have delved deeper at the time (I think that restriction was only for the low price version, there was a more expensive one that maybe didnt, but I was not sure).

#35 Personally I like this site. It is a sad truth that you cannot make everyone happy. Because of torque I feel that my game is closer to being complete than It has been in the two years I've been working on it. In short I like the work that's being done here. I've got no problem displaying the logo. Keep up the good work.

#36 What's the big friggin deal?

I knew full well before I bought TGE about the logo requirement. The EULA is very plain and clear to read. Sure, it's not right at the top of the product page in bold letters, but why should it? So what if you have to put a logo at the front? I would be happy to give credit to the people who made my product work... I wouldnt even need to be told to do that in the EULA, I would do it anyway.

#37 Yeah this is the same all over. Everyone wants to use somebody's engine but oh nellie if they have to display the engine logo.

Take Reality Factory for example it's free yet I've seen a bunch of people wanted to know if it's ok to remove the logo on startup. So even when it's free they still gripe about having to display the engine logo.

Heck I can't count how many commercial games I've played that have 5-6 logo's on startup.

#38 I don't understand it either. To me it makes your product look more legitimate if you use an established engine. I would still display the logo because it lets your game buyers know that this isnt some shoddy piece of software. Besides like zen said every commercial game displays logos its just a standard.

#39 Gotta agree with the general concensus here. If I ever run into the 'problem' of needing the commercial license for a game I make, I'll leave the indie-license-required splash screen in place. Heck, I'd probably put the splash screen in even if the indie-license didn't require it. The sheer *value* of the engine means GG deserves that much.

#40 Well said Theo