Possible FPS/team idea
by Paul Malyschko · in Game Design and Creative Issues · 12/05/2001 (7:38 pm) · 12 replies
I had a quick thought while I was at work.
I'm sure someone has had similar ideas before, just had a bit of a thought and thought I'd better spill it before I lost it.
I somehow got the idea of chess in my head -- not sure where from -- and thought about team games like Rogue Spear I think... just stuff like accurately placing your team members before making the killing strike.
I thought, it would be cool to be able to play a team game single-player, although there are invariably always the problems associated with controlling four members at once, especially if controlling them is complicated.
Instead, why not be only able to control one member at a time, to 'place the pieces', so to speak, and then, once you thought you had them in place to be successful, set about an 'automated' operation, whereby all your members of a team do their thing (whatever that may be), but you don't actually have too much control over what you've done -- most of it depends on how well you set them up to begin with.
To explain more clearly, an example (a Ghostbusters' FPS -- how corny -- wow just checked search engines, looks like there is a GB game!!):
You're Egon. You're quietly roaming in some ancient library. You've nuked a couple of ghosts already. You finally come up to the main doors.
*SWITCH MEMBERS*
Now its Ray's turn. He's right at the start. You navigate him through a few corridors, nuke a couple of Slimers and there you go. You arrive at another set of main doors.
*SWITCH MEMBERS*
Go Pete! You have nothing but Egon's new invention, the Big Ghost Trap Catcher Zimdoohickey (tm). It's big, so you've got to avoid the ghosts now. You follow a different path, avoid a Slimer somehow, and end up at another set of main doors.
Everyone is in position. Time to do your 'set piece'.
Depending on their morale, how much energy they have left, things like that, how well they are set up, etc, will be your initial settings. You then press the 'GO!' button and everything begins rolling.
The little timer bar for working the trap you've set up is going, and you press the space bar frantically (gotta push it as many times as you can to get everyone going and hopefully get the BigBossSlimer (tm) into the Zimdoohickey (tm) before the time runs out, otherwise you face a ridiculously big boss battle.
Because you managed to get everyone set up real well, you manage to trap BigBossSlimer. If not, you would've had to do an FPS style battle with one of your characters (while the dodgy AI took over the rest of the characters).
Actually, for some reason, sounds almost like a realtime version of X-Com. But do you see the idea? It's probably been done before -- I haven't played any new games for a very long time, so it wouldn't surprise me -- but I thought, what the hell, just post.
Paul
I'm sure someone has had similar ideas before, just had a bit of a thought and thought I'd better spill it before I lost it.
I somehow got the idea of chess in my head -- not sure where from -- and thought about team games like Rogue Spear I think... just stuff like accurately placing your team members before making the killing strike.
I thought, it would be cool to be able to play a team game single-player, although there are invariably always the problems associated with controlling four members at once, especially if controlling them is complicated.
Instead, why not be only able to control one member at a time, to 'place the pieces', so to speak, and then, once you thought you had them in place to be successful, set about an 'automated' operation, whereby all your members of a team do their thing (whatever that may be), but you don't actually have too much control over what you've done -- most of it depends on how well you set them up to begin with.
To explain more clearly, an example (a Ghostbusters' FPS -- how corny -- wow just checked search engines, looks like there is a GB game!!):
You're Egon. You're quietly roaming in some ancient library. You've nuked a couple of ghosts already. You finally come up to the main doors.
*SWITCH MEMBERS*
Now its Ray's turn. He's right at the start. You navigate him through a few corridors, nuke a couple of Slimers and there you go. You arrive at another set of main doors.
*SWITCH MEMBERS*
Go Pete! You have nothing but Egon's new invention, the Big Ghost Trap Catcher Zimdoohickey (tm). It's big, so you've got to avoid the ghosts now. You follow a different path, avoid a Slimer somehow, and end up at another set of main doors.
Everyone is in position. Time to do your 'set piece'.
Depending on their morale, how much energy they have left, things like that, how well they are set up, etc, will be your initial settings. You then press the 'GO!' button and everything begins rolling.
The little timer bar for working the trap you've set up is going, and you press the space bar frantically (gotta push it as many times as you can to get everyone going and hopefully get the BigBossSlimer (tm) into the Zimdoohickey (tm) before the time runs out, otherwise you face a ridiculously big boss battle.
Because you managed to get everyone set up real well, you manage to trap BigBossSlimer. If not, you would've had to do an FPS style battle with one of your characters (while the dodgy AI took over the rest of the characters).
Actually, for some reason, sounds almost like a realtime version of X-Com. But do you see the idea? It's probably been done before -- I haven't played any new games for a very long time, so it wouldn't surprise me -- but I thought, what the hell, just post.
Paul
About the author
#2
I used to play a strategy game on the PSX (forgot the name of) where players 'programed' the A.I. of thier battle mechs useing a simple interface...a GREAT game...the battles were done in real time (but you couldn't control anything)...so the game was won/lost in the 'programing' phase....it gave me a lot of pride when my stock, genaric mechs could easily beat much more powerful ones because of how I 'programed' the A.I.
12/06/2001 (3:15 pm)
The new X-Com game was going to be something like that, I think...I used to play a strategy game on the PSX (forgot the name of) where players 'programed' the A.I. of thier battle mechs useing a simple interface...a GREAT game...the battles were done in real time (but you couldn't control anything)...so the game was won/lost in the 'programing' phase....it gave me a lot of pride when my stock, genaric mechs could easily beat much more powerful ones because of how I 'programed' the A.I.
#3
12/06/2001 (5:27 pm)
That Mech game was called "Armored Core" 
#4
12/06/2001 (5:43 pm)
Actually it was called "Carnage Heart" :)
#5
Oh well worth a shot. The more I thought about it, the more I thought someone would've done something similar to that no doubt already :).
Paul
12/06/2001 (5:56 pm)
Bugger :)Oh well worth a shot. The more I thought about it, the more I thought someone would've done something similar to that no doubt already :).
Paul
#6
12/06/2001 (6:34 pm)
You know, I would say go for it anyway. Even if there is a game out there that is similar to the one you had in mind, it's not the same (story, atmosphere, etc...). Make a game *you* want to play, if it becomes everything you hoped it to be, you'll be stoked.
#7
12/06/2001 (8:12 pm)
All the same the idea of different units working together towards an ultimate end is stimulating to the mind, and thus fun. One thing to look out for is the playing field. Chess is fun because you can see everything your oponent is doing (or can you?) and there isn't much space to run. I think a game like this would need to have small scenarios with constantly visible terrain.
#8
Gameplay would be really quite good where more planning is involved rather then point and shoot, instead of pitting reflexes and stats against stats, it would be more of an intelectual challenge. Say in a team-based shooter, it would make the event of a smaller force beating a larger force more down to tactical advantages then pure reflexes and luck.
12/06/2001 (11:45 pm)
I agree, when planning stratagies, not being able to see the playing field would make it kind of futile. If going for a programable AI approach, it would probably be best to keep the playing field small, and the objectives simple. Even a simple objective of "capture point X", could make for quite an interesting strategic challenge depending on the terrain, and of course the enemy. To take chess as an example again, the objective is very simple - neutralise(sp?) the king - but acheiving the objective can be quite a challenge never the less.Gameplay would be really quite good where more planning is involved rather then point and shoot, instead of pitting reflexes and stats against stats, it would be more of an intelectual challenge. Say in a team-based shooter, it would make the event of a smaller force beating a larger force more down to tactical advantages then pure reflexes and luck.
#9
Actually I think the "Mental Aspect" is one of the reasons games like MGS and "Deus-Ex" are so popular! To be successful at those you not only need to use your trigger finger--you need to use your HEAD.
(Of course, on one of my internships, our lunchtime 'Quake' became exercises in strategy!)
12/07/2001 (5:00 am)
Oops on the game title!Actually I think the "Mental Aspect" is one of the reasons games like MGS and "Deus-Ex" are so popular! To be successful at those you not only need to use your trigger finger--you need to use your HEAD.
(Of course, on one of my internships, our lunchtime 'Quake' became exercises in strategy!)
#10
12/07/2001 (7:52 am)
"There is not a milieu or genre, despite having already been done, that cannot be done better. Do not abandon a good idea because something similar has already been done, or you will never do anything."
#11
12/07/2001 (12:47 pm)
Actually, any game that you play enough develops a certain strategy. I only played up to Quake 1, which had numerous strategies at its core that most people didn't realize until Quake3 came out. I didn't play Quake 2 because I liked it, but because I was forced to for 2 months straight. And believe it or not, really interesting tricks and strategies developed. Right now all I play are arcade games. In these games developers simply give you the competetive tools. For example a current favirot right now, entitled Marvel vs. Capcom 2 has 50 characters, and you pick 3 for your team. Using each character well and together is integral in being good in the game. But there are only certain ways you can use your other characters and penelties for each. Something like this system has an infinate learning curve, possible strategies (for those of you that play this game you know what I mean), and overal complexity. I actually believe that the more simplistic you make the game the more strategy it has, as long as you put bugs in your game. In Quake for example, who knew rocket jumping would develop into an art? Or simple differences between moving up and jumping would develop strategies. Who knew in Quake 2 that if you jumped just right at any point you could get double the height? Who knew in MVC2 that Cable could AHVB 5 times in a row? These are just examples, but now let me apply it to a universal game: chess. Chess you have simple pieces with simple movements, and yet we have huge mainframes playing this game. On the other end I don't think Counter-Strike is simple. It has many nuiances to it, like weapon choice, character placement, aim, etc. I got bored of CS because it simply took too long to master. I only play CS now at lan parties on the glass foor level. Anyway, simplicity wins overall in my opinion. Just make your game simple ;)
#12
Back to chess, you can learn the basics in a few hours(how the pieces moves, a couple of openings, etc), but people have spent a lifetime mastering it!
12/08/2001 (6:41 am)
But remember simple does not equal simplistic. Back to chess, you can learn the basics in a few hours(how the pieces moves, a couple of openings, etc), but people have spent a lifetime mastering it!
James "Neo" D
But I know I've seen this somewhere.
(of course you're talking about someone whold like to see a game like "Shenmue" as an MMORPG!)