Western RTS

#1 I think there was a game like that a few years ago (like a Western version of Caesar) but what you're talking about really sounds better. ;)

In the area of westerns, I've always thought that True Grit would make a great game. Unfortunately for me, it's one of those things where you've got the feeling of would it could be, but nothing else to go along with it. :(

#2 One of my side projects are a western game and its about
bandits stealing from banks in differnt towns on the same map.
And sheriffs should defend them.
Its not a RTS only ,sorry :)

#3 There has been some good ideas kicking around on the forums for westerns for a while. Here's a few links:

www.garagegames.com/mg/forums/result.thread.php?qt=17170
www.garagegames.com/mg/forums/result.thread.php?qt=12778
www.garagegames.com/mg/forums/result.thread.php?qt=10890
www.garagegames.com/mg/forums/result.thread.php?qt=7174
www.garagegames.com/mg/forums/result.thread.php?qt=1607

Personally I would love to see an indie western rts. I guess:
- Resources would be gold
- Prospectors would collect gold
- Cowboys would attack / defend
- Deputies / Sheriff would be stronger attacker / defender
- Horses could carry 1 cowboy
- Stagecoach could carry 4 cowboys
- Buildings would be ranch (build cowboys and horses), sheriffs office would build deputies / sheriffs, mine would produce gold

Im sure you could carry on thinking of these all day!

#4 Gotta have a distressed girl on the train tracks in there somewhere :)

personally i think tims art assets would be perfect for a mad max style game. infact i just might make one once Illumina is finished.

#5 Where's the new gameplay though? All the suggestions I've read in this thread are basically to take a tired old formula and stick a new graphics style on it, which is ultimately a waste of your time and effort. I don't wanna be a naysayer shooting down ideas, but your energy would be better spent looking for a more original idea (with new gameplay, not a new scenario with gameplay tweaks).

#6 Mad Max? That a western?

Wow, this is nuts, so many names I recognize from projects :P

But yea I agree on the distressed girl and stuff :P I was thinking instead of "building" units you should have to either go out and look for them, or wait for them to come to you, or like capture people and force them to join your village, who would in time produce young (trying not to use any graphic words there that might get people who aren't looking for this kind of site at all and are more after the kinda games some people might play in garages :P) These young you could train and then maybe establish your own little town funded entirely by the cowboy's missions. I dunno, once again since I'm not making the game I'm not exactly narrowing down each detail to a point.

#7 @Andrew
How is putting new graphics on a "tired old formula" a waste of time? RTS games are fun, and there is not to much more that could be done to them to really make it original gameplay. Lots of the big games out are "clones" so to speak of another game.

As for this, I think it would be fun with the stuff Craig mentioned. For the standard building that all RTS games have you start with, you could have a "town hall" type building. From there you could hire construction workers that would build your buildings. Have the Sheriff's Office, Ranch, Saloon/Hotel (For a hospital so to speak, units could be repaired, etc"). All kinds of ideas could be thought up for this.

Good luck to anyone that decides to take it on.

EDIT: Typo

#8 @Andrew :)

There are no pro or indie developer that have any new formulas !
I have played games so long and havent seen any new formulas yet ,they are still the same fps,rpg or rts and have been for last 10 or 20 years.

#9 www.jowood.com/gamers/?site=2&lang=en&GameID=farwest

#10 In the case of a western, I certainly wouldn't want to make it a traditional RTS. War would happen at times, but it would most often be a sort of action game.

Actually, I think an overhead form of Abuse-style gunplay would be in order. The reason is its similarity to the old game Tin Star. (Anyone ever play that?) The difference would be that you can move around with the keyboard instead of just moving the cross-hairs.

Agape.

#11 The problem with using the old formula for RTS games is that 99% of them suck or have horrible balance. The RTS genre seems to be the new crap FPS clone war that heated up with Doom (or the interactive movie clone genre that is still going strong after Myst). I've been sick of resource building since Starcraft (actually since Warcraft inspired God knows how many companies to make horrible resource schemes). There are some excellent RTS games out there, but the vast majority are extremely unbalanced crappy clones. Just like the uninspired levels you see in a lot of FPS's released after Doom and Quake. I've been burned on RTS games more than I have on FPS's, which is saying quite a lot.

That being said, I'd love to see a kick-ass RTS game released by an indie because we don't have to be tied to the "Command and Conquer did well last year, let's make a game like that but set on a moonbase" mentality that usually produces a game with one-tenth the balance and less than one-hundredth the entertainment value. One of the most refreshing things about the newest Warhammer RTS is the concept of resources being based upon holding your settlments and fortifications. You don't have to concentrate nearly as much on the hunter-gather slow-down. You feel like you're actively playing a game rather than waiting for either your base to be attacked while you troops are harvesting grain to feed themselves and mining in the mountains so that you can build another nuke to attack the enemy while they're away from the base harvesting materials.

With the upcoming RTS pack, I see great potential in what we can create as indies, but we either need to make something different that stands out in the RTS genre or craft a clone so well that people can't tell it's a clone.

I think that western environments are great, and people love making western games like Desperados, Red Dead Revolver, Western Outlaw: Wanted Dead or Alive, or Hatfields and the McCoy, but we actually need some good western games. I enjoyed Desperados, but it was essentially an extremely limited Commandos in a western setting. Red Dead Revolver was a fun shooter, but the level design was either really nice, or really, really bland.

@Craig Ball
Looking at the links, I'm reminded of the heated discussion about the definition protagonists in a Billy the Kid scenario. I think that discussion is locked away behind closed firewalls.

@Thomas Glennow
Far West looks interesting. I may just have to pick it up!

@Ben
The game I was working on before I realized that I like playing shooters much more than I like making them was kind of like that (though it was in a modern setting). I love Abuse targeting and the top-down look and feel. I, unfortunately, didn't enjoy making the game. I'm rescupting the engine changes and looking at another idea I've been tooling around with for a long time. Of course, I don't know if making a faction-based action-RPG would be any more exciting for me.

EDIT: added comments to this post rather than creating a new post.

#12 Pick a popular culture genre (or mix 2+)...

[ ] sci-fi
[ ] cyberpunk
[ ] fantasy
[ ] medieval
[ ] western
[ ] 50's gangster
[ ] pirates
[ ] mafia
[ ] military
[ ] zombie/horror
[ ] super-hero
[ ] sport

...then pick a video game genre (or mix 2+)...

[ ] rts
[ ] rpg
[ ] mmorpg
[ ] fps
[ ] action
[ ] adventure
[ ] puzzle
[ ] sport
[ ] racing
[ ] flight

Whammo -- instant game!

P.S. If you use my patented method be sure to credit me and send me a portion of the profits.

#13 I want to make a cyberpunk super-hero pirate MMORPG. You can attack galleons with your laser eyes to steal their gold, and then you can jack into the Captain's Quarters and chat with your friends to brag about your exploits.

#14 Ok, looks like theres some awesome ideas here guys! All thought up in one day. This is pretty amazing. The pro's should do these kinda things :P

#15 I dare anyone here to tell me their "original" idea, because I can probably find at least another game very similar in existence. So all those people within this thread that complain that this "western themed RTS" isn't an original idea- please go somewhere else. And while we are at it, please tell me how these games are original: Realm Wars, Dark Horizons, Think Tanks, Marble Blast... hell even Tribes2. Sure there are original aspects to those games, but aren't they all just theme+genre?

As far as a western themed RTS goes, I think this could work. Craig Ball had some very intuitive associations that work within a classic RTS framework, but on a smaller scale. This lends a huge amount of scalability to the game as well as a lot of new opportunities.

What if you could add "gangs" to your posse. They could steal the opponents horses, wagons... even rob the opponents banks (where the gold is stored).

Devs could even mix in an old fashioned "Cowboys and Indians" mode (I am Native American, so I feel that I can be so non-Politically Correct). Indians could hunt buffalo for resources (instead of gold)- from there they can build their own weapons or take the hides to a trader for cash to buy rifles, or whatever. They must defend their tribe from Calvary and local Towns. One unique aspect to the Indians, is that they would have to follow the buffalo herd, and not completely deplete the resource. So they would be truly nomadic and must constantly defend new territory.

RTS does have to have a complex economy and micromanagement. Check out Warlocked for Gameboy, very intuitive gameplay considering the lack of buttons and it doesn't take 30+ minutes to build your armies. Its very suitable for a "quick fix".

#16 My problem with the RTS genre isn't one of originality, but stagnancy. It's more stagnant than the FPS right now, with a record number of titles trying to cash in and the fun factor being next to nil. A game doesn't have to be original to avoid being stagnant. It simply needs to have the time and love put into it to make it good and balanced rather than tossed at the shelves of an already overstocked market.

#17 ... And here we are. The thread has come to the "lack-of-originality" phase.

My view on originality is a modest one: It is hopeless to try and think up a creation that is completely orthogonal to all others (hence, an original one). Now I will be philosophical: What game is more pleasant, more well-dressed, and more well-designed than the lillies of the field? I have accepted that games are inferior, because for God's sake they are.

However, games *themselves* are not hopeless. Just make what you know, and keep it simple! (Stupid. :P). Don't fret over a game being "unoriginal". It does not matter. Make a game that is aligned with your beliefs and your tastes, that has a special bond with something from your childhood. Keep the rules very clear, trim, and simple. This way, the game is more easily finished. :)

Agape.

#18 I like superhero puzzle games, oh yeah and pirate sports

#19 If u want to make it unique you should a different resource requirement.

Perhaps the good guys (sheriffs e.t.c) have an established base and there resources come in waves (via a train or horse and cart)


the bad guys have a cave (or homestead or soemthing) and there resources come from attacking the trains/banks e.t.c e.t.c

sheriffs play more of a defending role (defending a town/protecting its people and get bonuses for succeeding).

bad guys play the attacking role, capturing banks , kidnapping girls e.t.c

in multi sheriffs would essentially play allies to eachother whislt the badguys play an individual game (everyone onto everyone)

there should be some system for one on one gun duals.

#20 Ian has some great ideas... As do many of you... This thread is getting really based around the "This is unoriginal" "Unoriginality isn't bad" "This is Original" type talk, so if we could keep that to a minimum it'd be great. I think this would work pretty well as a community project if no team wants to take it on for themselves.

Randall's ideas are pretty awesome too...

What if the units could go inside buildings and stuff? (As far as I know no other RTS has done that yet, I think Myth III was supposed to have it, but I have a feeling it was taken out from the final version) How about if character's can build legend for themselves, so each unit would get a name, and as they gain legend people in town will hide inside their homes and in battles the enemies will be hesitant to attack, also your allies that are nearby would be empowered by that unit being nearby. Low legend people fear high legend people type stuff... It makes the game more interesting when your units refuse to attack because their too busy soiling themselves.