Game distribution with large content

#1 This is something we're exploring.

At the moment, there is nothing definite in this direction.

Focus on getting your game done first. ;) If you want to publish online, then you shouldn't plan on going above 100-150megs.

#2 Yeah, Trajectory Zone will be probably close to 100MB when it's finished.

I'm thinking of building my own spinfusor and just whizzing CDs to customers. I hope they can safely catch them. :P

#3 Its amazing how much you can shrink a game by taking out unessecary art. We did it with Produce Panic (where there was a LOT of unessecary art, as we used the base from another project we worked on). It went from 40 meg to 23. :| Dunno what that has to do with anything, but thought I would share :D

#4 Ben Garney:

If a project goes above 300 megs, will GG say no?

#5 Use steam maybe...

or MAYBE NOT

#6 It depends on the project. I don't make sales decisions; Jay and Jeff do. I do know that the "magic number" for online games (especially for demos) is around a hundred megs. More and you start losing people.

If you're clever, you can do a _LOT_ in a hundred megs. ThinkTanks is 18 megs, and Lore is a hundred.

So, if you want to publish online, with anyone, not just GG, going over 125, 150 megs is a bad idea. If you want to publish on physical media, then one CD is probably a good magic number.

#7 On a side note, UT2004 is 5GBs (installed). Wow. 4 or 5 discs in the box.
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TZ offers a lot in audio... custom level songs and voice-overs being the two largest MB hoggers. I could probably squeeze out a few MB by either using pngcrush or converting them all to a very nice jpeg. I'm on 56k, and this last 80MB beta took about 3-4 hours to download, I believe.

But then, there are games like UT2004 that the demo alone is several times that.

#8 I was considering this as well. Our current content is around 100mb (haven't done a shakedown yet), and that just about 1/3 of whats left. I was thinking about having something more 'episodic' for us...have the first major content with the initial release, and then have our new "chaptors" as add-ons. Our game is designed to work like that anyway, and it might keep things going. Perhaps this is a method to consider for others with large projects?

#9 Why not just use a CD on Demand service? It seems to be working for Matrix Games. Then the customer has a choice. Download or wait for a CD for an extra charge. These companies are all over so I won't recommend any specific one. But keep in mind it should cost about $.86 per CD plus distribution. That was one price I saw. It should be pretty cheap per disk + some packaging if you like. Its not that bad even it if costs an extra $2-3 per CD. Market at your regular price. Give them the choice at the point of purchase. I don't think many people will mind if they can buy a game for $19.99 and download it or buy it for $22.99 and have it mailed to them. But I would look around for the best price and service record.

#10 Actually it should probably be backwards now. cheaper to get a CD than download since bandwidth is getting EXPENSIVE compared to CD's.

#11 Lets take a look.

Over Bandwidth [May 01, 2004 ]. Let's say you sell 1000 copies of your CD and your game is 100Mb. Bandwidth required is 100 GB. Its 49.99/per month at ipowerweb for a dedicated server allowing 500 GB transfer or about $600/year this doesn't take in account any of the cost of maintaining the server. An expense.

CD on Demand [May 01, 2004 ]. The same 1000 copies would cost, ~$4.99 shipping and handling. Some distributors charge 20% to take of this type of thing but thats a side issue I won't get into it here. So now you're talking $4999 to distribute. The bonus is catering to those who don't want to download 100Mb. The idea is to increase your market.
Also, the 'customer' pays the extra fees. Not you. Although you'll have to develop a version of your game that works as a CD. I don't think I need to explain that part other then customers expect CD's to work in a specific manner. Also, this has the downside of 'returns' or packages reported lost. There's more but I won't cover it.

Anyways, the Question was Game distribution with large content. this is one way. Another is to get a publisher. For some this may not be an option or for others this is an option but they don't want to go that route.

#12 I have not seen a CD on demand service that is anywhere near as cheap as what you saying.

-Jeff Tunnell GG

#13 Grabware is as low as $3.50 for CD on Demand. I did my speculation at $4.99/per CD. Most art content sites charge $20 to burn to CD. Provide the option to burn to CD for an extra charge of $5.00 + Shipping and Handling. Your problem is solved. Shop around locally you might find a local printer thats willing to give you an excellent deal such as .86 cents/unit. Thats what I did.

Get to know other business people in your area, you can strike up a good deal for yourself and help out a local business. I've found that many people like to be involved in making games, even if its just manufacturing some CD's. You can do the same to get cheap Recording studio time, Actors to do voice overs, sketch artists, everything you need is probably within walking distance from your computer.

#14 Just as a suggestion, maybe GG should look into a universal packaging distribution program or auto-downloader for downloads. First you would download this and install it, then it would take care of any demos/purchased games and download them effortlessly in the background (maybe using compression as well). I've used GetRight and RealArcade to download games myself, maybe a deal can be worked out or something?

Just trying to help find a solution. :)

- Ronixus

#15 This sounds a little like Steam, which I personally think is not a bad thing. I was always thinking that a Torque/GG game browser that offered news bits, chat rooms and the ability to download demos and purchase full games.

Is bandwidth really still a big problem now? On average, the major game demos these days come in at around 100+ megs. One of the most popular online games, America's Army is like 600mb and its download only. MMORPGs that go into public beta tests or trials are often 1GB or so, and they see quite a number of players at a given time. I'm pretty sure not everyone is going to want to download 500 megs for every game that comes around, but these days it seems 100-200 megs are becoming the standard for most demos...why not full games?

#16 A major problem with big downloads is the market. Hardcore gamers have highspeed connections and are very willing to wait through a day's or a night's worth of downloading to get what they want.

But hardcore gamers also tend to only buy into those big-name games.

Casual gamers have slower connections, crappier hardware, and less patience.

#17

Quote:But hardcore gamers also tend to only buy into those big-name games.

I'm working on fixing that :)

Quote:Casual gamers have slower connections, crappier hardware, and less patience.

Very true...I don't know any 500MB casual games tho, but it would be interesting to see one :D

#18 Yeah, our project will probably be roughly 300 - 500 meg, with movies... Ive been thinking of ingenious ways to distribute it. I was thinking of doing section downloads. The core game would be about 100 megs, then maybe each level would be a download, since our game is mainly online, The players would download only the levels they want to play. There are alot of neat ways to explore this, However, i am not going to make my game under 100m just to please ppl who download them.. were focusing on making the best game we possibly can in a 2 year timeframe.. if that long... Size is not an issue, if the game is good people will download and play it.

#19 How do you get games with over 1 or 2 gigs on a disc or how do you get the same file to be expanded on to multiple discs

#20 @Eric:

Just encapsulate the CD in a ferro shell and use a large rail gun to shoot it the customer's way.