Skeletal Crash System

#1 Sounds a bit like "ragdoll" techniques.

There are a few posts on the forums about Ragdoll, or rather implementing more advanced physics effects in torque.

#2 It's a bit more than the "ragdoll" techniques. In these, every fall is of a collection of pre-made falls. In this crash system, every, and I mean EVERY, fall is different. This means that all crashes were NOT pre-made, but completely random.
So, yeah.

sp

#3 No, ragdoll is based off of a simulated approximation of the skeletal system. So there are no pre-made falls. :)

#4 As i understand it in ragdoll u set the maximum range of movement in a joint etc, kind of like setting IK. What you are saying about this skeletal crash system is precisely that ;)

#5 Thanks for clearing that up. However, I still think that we should use this method in different games, and not just sport games. Is it used in other games?

sp

#6 Unreal tournament 2003 is the big-name that uses it. They kinda bought the whole ragdoll physics thing to everyones attention really (not saying they were the first, but certainly put it on the map)

its a nice feature to add if you have the time and resources (and above all know-how) to do it, but it doesn't really add THAT much to a game.

#7 The new Medal Of Honour (Pacific Assault) game from EA has it.

#8 Postal 2 has it aswell. Thou I didn't notice it much.

Lots have it. Its kinda a new big thing thats coming in.

#9 Halo has it.

#10 Please, let's not talk about Postal 2. That game is extremely blasphemous as it is.

What is it called when a game has pre-recorded crashes, like Tony Hawk's Pro Skater 2/3/4/ and Tony Hawk Underground? I thought it was ragdoll physics.

Spunk

#11 Those are just animations that get played when you fall off. Probably tweened with the current animation and selected from things like what you hit and how fast you were going.

You will know if its a ragdoll system because the players body will react to the environment (ie rolling down stairs or falling over railings).

and Postal 2 had ragdoll because it used the Unreal Engine.

But theres more games that have it now than I can poke a stick at. It does add a LOT to the realism of a game... no more limbs sticking through walls YAY.

#12 Just because an engine has ragdoll physics for death animations does not guarantee that the collision detection won't have limbs sticking thru walls and stuff. Because I have seen that still in every game that has ragdoll physics that I have played recently.

And it TAKE AWAY alot of realism if done wrong. There are a few games where things are way to bouncy because of crappy ragdoll implementations. Someone was talking about how some game detracted from the gameplay because barrels went flying at the slightest touch and bodies could be flung across great distances and bounced way to much.

#13 Yes, that'd be Deus Ex 2. But, the idea is there, the implementation was a bit... odd.

and I know limbs still stick through objects occasionally, but you have to admit the effect is much more realistic even if that does happen. Id rather shoot a guy and have him tumble down some stairs or through a window, then maybe get his arm stuck in a wall, than hit him and he just falls down, the same way, every time.

After playing ragdoll games, and going back to normal animated deaths (eg Call Of Duty) it is very noticable.

#14 Cool, I had no idea that it was used in as many games as it is!

@Dylan

Yes, that was very unenjoyable when that happened - it drastically decreased the realism.

Spunk

#15 Just a matter of opinion but I prefer well animated fall or death sequences over ragdoll physics.
While the ragdoll effect is neat that is about it. I mean it fails to take into acount for involuntary muscle spasms as well as muscle dynamics.
Thus they literally fall like a "ragdoll" which isn't at all like a person.
Although I think it is easier to incorporate ragdoll physics into a game rather than have 20 different death animations.

#16 Zen,

I agree with that, but what if the company made a code so that when their body came to a rest on the floor, it would spasm? So the animation's still random, but it does give the death a bit more realism.

Spunk

#17 Halo had kicking.

#18 Spasms aren't really all that common in dead people. It really depends on the manner of death. Generally, you shoot something and it just goes limp.

#19 That depends really. Shoot someone and they will twitch as their nervous system self destructs. It's not an uncommon thing.

#20 Postal 2 kicked ass..
it was great.

I love the cat silencer .. Too Funny.