Video Codecs and File size
by Nick "Dig" Koirala · in General Discussion · 07/05/2003 (6:07 pm) · 10 replies
Here's a strange question...
The Demo of my game is about 10MB at the moment, I have an animated company logo which will add 2.5MB to that for only a 10 second clip.
Two quesitons:
1) Is this a problem?
2) What are good codecs to use for compression and what are the license issues. Of course I don't want people to have to download and install a codec just to see the opening 10seconds of the game. With AVI support only working for windows in Torque it has to be a codec that comes with windows pretty much as standard...
Cheers,
Nick
The Demo of my game is about 10MB at the moment, I have an animated company logo which will add 2.5MB to that for only a 10 second clip.
Two quesitons:
1) Is this a problem?
2) What are good codecs to use for compression and what are the license issues. Of course I don't want people to have to download and install a codec just to see the opening 10seconds of the game. With AVI support only working for windows in Torque it has to be a codec that comes with windows pretty much as standard...
Cheers,
Nick
#2
@Nick - if you can use divx as it is good compression codec. Anyways I'm not really sure about for 56k users (haven't been on 56k for a long time) but for me I wouldn't mind it as it would only take me 10 seconds to download a 12.5mb demo :D I don't think others will mind if you ahve some good footage in it that shows stuff rather then a retarted flythrough that ends up not showing anything :)
--KallDrexx
07/05/2003 (8:48 pm)
@Ben - Um I think he means a 10 second gameplay demo and he wants to add an animated company logo which will add 2.5mb to the actual video (non-playable demo I think he means by the title). @Nick - if you can use divx as it is good compression codec. Anyways I'm not really sure about for 56k users (haven't been on 56k for a long time) but for me I wouldn't mind it as it would only take me 10 seconds to download a 12.5mb demo :D I don't think others will mind if you ahve some good footage in it that shows stuff rather then a retarted flythrough that ends up not showing anything :)
--KallDrexx
#3
Grab the Windows Media Encoder and try it out.
07/07/2003 (6:03 am)
The Windows Media 9 Codecs are top notch and any Windows Media player will download them automatically.Grab the Windows Media Encoder and try it out.
#4
If you can afford a program like Media Cleaner Pro, you will also get better compression results, though it will take longer to compress. You can also tweak the settings a lot more.
If you are using a wrapper like Quicktime or AVI, you can switch between different codecs from scene to scene, so if you wanted to use the Animation codec for your logo and the Sorenson codec for your in game footage, you could have it all contained within the same file.
I would only use windows media format if your game is windows only. The mac version of WMP is barely functional, and I don't know if its available for linux.
07/07/2003 (12:19 pm)
Different codecs are effective for different purposes. if you have mostly full-motion full screen video, codecs like MPEG4 and Sorenson usually give the best quality to size ratio. Codecs like Quicktime's animation codec are better for lower-movement video, as the create less artifacting with solid color areas.If you can afford a program like Media Cleaner Pro, you will also get better compression results, though it will take longer to compress. You can also tweak the settings a lot more.
If you are using a wrapper like Quicktime or AVI, you can switch between different codecs from scene to scene, so if you wanted to use the Animation codec for your logo and the Sorenson codec for your in game footage, you could have it all contained within the same file.
I would only use windows media format if your game is windows only. The mac version of WMP is barely functional, and I don't know if its available for linux.
#7
08/11/2003 (4:56 am)
XviD is excellent, but it's also GPL which gives most people cause to be concerned. 
#8
http://www.theora.org/
But i don't think it has had a stable release(aka non alpha) yet =)
08/11/2003 (5:29 am)
You could try theora :http://www.theora.org/
But i don't think it has had a stable release(aka non alpha) yet =)
#9
But Nick didn't want people to have to download and install a codec, that leaves only the default windows codecs.
08/11/2003 (7:09 am)
Xvid is cool yes, but so is Indeo 5.11 (if your video is a power of 2 in dimensions, 320x240 etc). But Nick didn't want people to have to download and install a codec, that leaves only the default windows codecs.
#10
Codecs:
Yes you can get codecs that will compress the video/audio data streams down to something small, but you also need to take into consideration the fact that most people don't have these Codecs in their system.
End users are very reluctant to download and install extra items to play the game (and really they shouldn't), you cannot secretly install the codecs on their drives so if you do it through the game's install process you will have to alert them, and they are also very leary of installing 3rd party software in case it contains SpyWare (as some of the free Codecs have in them).
Cross-Platform:
I haven't seen many people bring the cross-platform subject up here and I am not sure why. Having your game on Windows, Mac, and Linux increases your potential sales and revenue. As such keep in mind that not all Codecs nor Video formats are available across all the aforementioned platforms.
There are only a few Codecs that are cross-platform and native to each system and none of these do a very good job at compressing the data while still leaving you with quality.
Extra Downloads:
Adding a video into your game adds a lot of unnecessary downloads to your game. As many other people have already mentioned we all need to keep in mind the fact that a lot of people are still on dialup, so if the video doesn't add anything to the gameplay IMHO you should cut it out.
If you are adding a 3rd party Codec installer to your game's install process, remember that this adds another few megs to the download progess.
Logan
08/11/2003 (8:44 am)
Here are a few thoughts that I think have either been overlooked or only briefly mentioned in this thread that I feel need to be brought up to the surface...Codecs:
Yes you can get codecs that will compress the video/audio data streams down to something small, but you also need to take into consideration the fact that most people don't have these Codecs in their system.
End users are very reluctant to download and install extra items to play the game (and really they shouldn't), you cannot secretly install the codecs on their drives so if you do it through the game's install process you will have to alert them, and they are also very leary of installing 3rd party software in case it contains SpyWare (as some of the free Codecs have in them).
Cross-Platform:
I haven't seen many people bring the cross-platform subject up here and I am not sure why. Having your game on Windows, Mac, and Linux increases your potential sales and revenue. As such keep in mind that not all Codecs nor Video formats are available across all the aforementioned platforms.
There are only a few Codecs that are cross-platform and native to each system and none of these do a very good job at compressing the data while still leaving you with quality.
Extra Downloads:
Adding a video into your game adds a lot of unnecessary downloads to your game. As many other people have already mentioned we all need to keep in mind the fact that a lot of people are still on dialup, so if the video doesn't add anything to the gameplay IMHO you should cut it out.
If you are adding a 3rd party Codec installer to your game's install process, remember that this adds another few megs to the download progess.
Logan
Associate Kyle Carter
Alternatively, consider reducing the resolution (ick!) or just putting a slideshow in, like the RealmWars demo. 10sec company logos are fancy, but for a demo that most people will play once and discard, your bytes are probably better spent. :)