TGB Pro license question

#1 I'm 99.99% certain that it's just a license change.

#2 It is a license change. You would need to change your game's startup code to remove the splash screen.

However, I would recommend contacting licensing at garagegames.com to discuss logo removal. The commercial license still requires a logo.

Under Section 4, subsection b).

Quote:(b) Licensee agrees to display a full screen Torque Game Builder logo in the start up sequence of any game created and released
with the Engine. This requirement may be waived for an additional fee. Contact licensing@garagegames.com for details.

#3 Beyond that, why remove the logo? I see displaying the GG logo as a sort of Badge of +1 Win (please excuse that last statement <.<)

I don't see how removing the GG logo is worth the price difference between the two. Why not just display it and be proud of your use of Torque?

#4 It's not a matter of displaying a logo. It's a matter of displaying an additional splash screen. If I could just add a GarageGames logo to the corner of my game's splash screen, I wouldn't have a problem with that at all. But having a separate splash screen -- I don't like that. It adds delay to the startup, annoying all players of the game.

#5 You may want to note that older versions of TGB commercial do not require a display of the TGB splashscreen. If you don't use things like behaviors, this may be a viable option.

#6 I believe 1.1.3+ have all included the splash screen in the license.

#7 I'm pretty sure it started with the latest version, after InstantAction(tm) came into the picture. There was a big fuss and discussion over it in the forums at the time. I'm also not a fan of the splash requirement for pro/commercial users. I hear if you contact GG and pay them yet more you can get the requirement removed.

#8 It was way before iac entered the picture. I'd have to go back and check. I don't remember if tgb was out of beta yet. I think so. It's been a long time!

#9 I'm 99.999% sure that before the most recent version which was the first update since IAC, commercial users were not required to display a splash screen.

Some references on the history of the TGB EULA and its splash screen shenanigans.

Here in 2005 I note how the game "Gold Fever" by TikGames did not display a GG logo splash, as it was licensed under the commercial license. At the time which did not require a splash.
http://www.garagegames.com/community/forums/viewthread/28363/4#comments

Here, in 2006 Philip Mansfield noted changes to the EULA which specified a time to display a splash screen for those under the "indie" license.
http://www.garagegames.com/community/forums/viewthread/44812

Here David you acknowledge the drastic changes to the EULA in the latest version of TGB. I know one year is a long time to remember...but things really changed with the release of TGB 1.7.4.
http://www.garagegames.com/community/forums/viewthread/71808/

Not only did the latest incarnation of the TGB EULA require a splash screen for ALL licenses commercial or indie, but it also makes distinctions and restrictions on what you can create. Educational and other software deemed "non games" by GG would require further license agreements it seems.


Also worth noting is this (excerpt from TGB 1.7.4 EULA):

(c) Licensee agrees to include in the "About" box or in the credits screen: (i) a link to http://www.garagegames.com, 
and (ii) the wording "This game is powered by Torque Game Builder Pro."  
This requirement may be waived for an additional fee.  Contact licensing@garagegames.com for details.

Many portals will not accept a game with in game links such as this. So you will likely have to pay this mysterious "additional fee" if you intend on making any casual games.

#10 I believe it was with the release of TGE 1.5.2; which changed across the products as well. I thought it was well before I started working here since I've gotten logo removal requests for at least two years. The latest version has always been under the restrictions. Where it split between 1.1.3 and 1.7 is fuzzy.

We've worked with a number of teams publishing on portals to remove specific pieces as per the portal requirements, but these are a one-on-one request since different portals have different requirements.

#11 The EULA change for the logo, as well as other EULA changes, across all engines happened either end of '06 or '07, I can't remember which.

#12 Oh wow, I've been out of the loop. I was blissfully thinking that the license agreement hadn't changed at all since the original version. Thanks for the links to those threads, Joe -- that helped catch me up.

I'm rather outraged at the 4-second logo display requirement. Is this still in effect? For the commercial version too?

I started developing with TGB knowing that I would upgrade to commercial prior to release, to avoid having to display the logo. 4 seconds is unacceptable for me. I downloaded 1.5.x and 1.7.x not knowing the EULA changed. And now I find that I can't even pay a reasonable amount of money ($1000) to get what I thought I already had? (The ability to not be forced to display a GG splash.) I must pay this *and* some unspecificed extra amount? That's insane. I have modified the source quite extensively, so going back to an older version is not reasonable. I'm *really* hoping the 4-second requirement is still not in effect. If so, I am not a happy camper.

#13 Just checked, and the 4 second requirement is not in the current EULA, both Indie and Commerical Thank goodness!

Just makes me glad I didn't upgrade to the Commercial version *earlier*, prior to the EULA getting changed, since the only reason for upgrading was changed without warning at some unknown time in the past. Thank goodness I didn't throw $1000 down the tubes for nothing.

#14 That's why I tried to post here quickly. I didn't want you purchasing something that wouldn't fit your bill.

#15 Appreciate it, thanks. :-)

#16 BTW, David -- am I correct that the 4-second requirement is no longer in place? (Given that I don't see it anywhere in the EULA.) I'm implementing the splash screen right as I type this, and want to be sure I'm not getting in any legal trouble.

If it *is* still in effect, it's true I can let the user click past it?

#17 Nope. That is no longer in the EULA.