EULA Clear up

#1 $500 for each user of the engine. If your artist isn't using the engine, but simply supplying you with fine drawings, you'll be fine being the only one paying. But if the artist needs to use the engine directly (other than you supplying an ad hoc build to verify the art looks as intended), one more licence is required.

I'm not 100% sure about the scripting bit; it may have been relaxed, but you'd definitely be fine if each scripter had the nearest desktop counterpart (TGB or TGE). The person with the full iTorque engine would then need to tweak the incoming levels a little, and maybe port some scripts into the source if necessary.

#2 Yea, I was hoping I wouldn't have to pay 500$ for each scripter, because if it's just me, then I can afford it. If not, well then I'm in trouble.

#3 Pretty please answer? =)

#4 If they have access to the tools, they have to be licensed.

#5 So even Scripters need to pay about 600$ each to work on an iPhone app?

#6 They can use the $100 license and go general scripting in T2D on Windows or a Mac. However, anything that requires access to the iPhone specific technology requires a license.

#7 So they can do the game mechanic scripting for the 100$ license, and I can do the iPhone porting? Can you please link me to the place where it mentions that 100$ T2D for scripters as well? I'm having a hard time finding it in the T2D End user license agreement. I just remember it being mentioned here on the forums so I brought it up. Thanks for the help so far.

#8 It is explicit in the restrictions rather than allowances, which is common for licensing. Note that in the licensing, the engine including tools cannot be shared with non-licensees. However, the binary engine for T2D (at $100) can be used to write scripts since they are licensees of T2D for the Mac and Windows (which is also included with T2D for iPhone). They are not, however, licensees of T2D for the iPhone, so you cannot provide them with any of the engine source nor access to the iPhone engine.

Basic scripting logic for your game, sure; as you could release it on the PC or Mac for desktop gamers. iPhone engine-specifics will need to be done by an iPhone licensee.

#9 I've got the pdf open right now, there is no mention of a 100$ scripting fee in the restrictions section, or the fees section =(, only a 250$ per programmer mention in the "Fees" section.

#10

Quote:(d) Licensee may not distribute the source code or documentation to the engine in any manner, unless recipient also has a license
to the Engine.
(e) Licensee may not distribute any Torque Game Builder-specific editors, including but not limited to the Level Builder, Tile
Builder and Particle Builder, in any manner, unless recipient also has a license to the Engine.

As a binary engine licensee, they will have access to these features (sans source code).

You cannot supply them with anything related to the iPhone engine. However, they can supply you with scripts that they write.

#11 On the "Buy Page" you can definitely buy engine sans source code for 100$, where is their separate EULA? Even when I uncheck "Include Source Code" the EULA linked below says that the programmer needs to pay 250$ in the fee section.

Am I missing a separate EULA?

#12 No. The "programmer" noted in the EULA that is required to pay $250 would have access to the C++ source code not the TorqueScript.

C++ programmers with the source version of T2D cannot provide binary licensees with the C++ code to the engine. iT2D programmers cannot provide the C++ source code to the iPhone engine.

The licensing flows like this:

binary ($100) > C++ programmers ($250) > iPhone developers ($500)

But it cannot flow the opposite direction.

EDIT for further clarification.
The binary licensees will never provide C++ source code to the C++ developers since they never have access to the source. However, they can provide TorqueScript to the source-level programmers. The C++ T2D developers will never provide iPhone specific C++ code to the iPhone developers since they will not have access to the iPhone C++ codebase. They, however, can provide code T2D C++ and TorqueScript changes to the iPhone programmers.

The iPhone programmers will never hand back iPhone-specific code to the more restricted tiers.

#13 I'm aware, but what EULA is the Binary agreeing to? It cannot be the C++ Programmer one, because it consistently refers to the user agreeing to it they are being licensed the engine. So where's the EULA for the binary buyers?

It seems like it needs to have different terms because it would totally mix up the binary buyers and C++ programmers in some of the EULA terms.

For example:

"Licensor grants Licensee a single 'seat' to an individual, a limited non-exclusive, non-transferable license to use the Engine for
the purposes of making source code and object code for an unlimited number of electronic single or multi-user games for
entertainment ("Games")."

Note the "Source code" in there. Conflicts with:

"(a) The TGB Indie Game License fee for the Engine is $250 per each programmer using or accessing the source code to the
Game(s). Licensee may not sell or otherwise distribute Games created with the Engine until the license fee has been paid. There
are no additional royalties, and Licensee does not have to show the Games or publish the Games with GarageGames."

This seems to imply that every license is letting you use the source code to make games, but everybody has to pay 250$ because that is the fee for anyone accessing the source code. Which is why I am curious, did I miss the separate EULA for the "Binary" Tier?

#14 Ah, I see where your confusion lies. I was looking at the EULA that ships with binary, which has the same clause, but notes the $100 tier just like the source version notes the $250 tier.

I'll contact the webteam about generating a PDF of both licenses to put up on the site.

#15 Sorry for all the hub-bub! I was just a bit confused on that note.

#16 NP. I just realized it when you said you had the PDF open and I was reading the text license that ships with it.